The Brian Cushing Precedent

Peter King supports the AP's decision to re-vote on the Defensive ROY Award given to Brian Cushing for his 2009 performance.  (For those who don't know, Cushing tested positive for the same hCG Manny Ramirez missed fifty games last year for.)  He doesn't give too many ideological reasons outside of his clear disdain for the use of PEDs in sports and his lack of concern for setting a difficult precedent.  That precedent, says King's colleague Don Banks, is not worth ignoring:

It may not always be a nice, neat, easy call, and that's why you don't toss out the principle of precedent every time you feel the whim. It may not be the case of the moment that requires much foresight, but the case that we don't yet know about, and is still unimagined, just might.

The truth?  It's somewhere in the middle.


One must be very clear about what is actually happening here.  The media, the football writers of America, are deciding that a player's performance on the field is not worth an accolade due to evidence of a performance enhancing drug.  In that regard there is no precedent being set here as the baseball writers have been keeping Mark McGwire's Hall of Fame credentials out of the Hall for a few years now.  This is not a league-given award.  The league is making no comment on the action outside the required four-game suspension.

Where is there a precedent?  The football writers are retroactively making mid-career decision that can significantly hamper a player's ability to achieve particular incentives in their contracts.  PFT touches on this fact:

Meanwhile, Brandt reports that Cushing's contract included a trigger based on winning the AP defensive rookie of the year award, resulting in a $2.219 million bonus.  But Cushing met other alternative triggers, which means that he'll keep the money even if he doesn't secure the honor based on do-over voting that closes at 12:00 p.m. E.T. on Wednesday.  

That was Cushing.  It won't be the next guy.  If the writers vote to remove this award from Cushing, you better believe that agents will remove every AP-based performance award from future contract negotiations and subsequently devalue the worth of the prize.  It's a step I'm glad the AP is willing to take but also a bold gesture that will open the door for other organizations to "boxing up" the MVP and Defensive Player of the Year awards.  ("Boxing up" is a phrase I just invented to mean the handing out of multiple awards, subsequently devaluing all of them.)  Those are awards are significant sources of pride for players, teams and fans.


And by making this move retroactively, the AP begins dancing to music they'll soon find it very difficult to maintain in-step with.  What if Cushing is the best defensive player of the year in 2010?  Will the writers assume he is not on the drugs?  If they assume that, can't they assume he would have been the same player without the drugs in 2009?   

My overwhelming feeling has been to look the other way on the use of performance enhancers in football.  None of us can imagine the wear and tear that the human body experiences over the course of a sixty-minute gridiron battle and if these guys need a couple hormones to be able to wake up on Monday morning, fine.  The stats in football don't matter, no matter what the fantasy geeks tell you.  And I don't believe for half-a-second that hCG made Brian Cushing better at rushing the passer or wrapping up Joseph Addai.  Did it make him faster and stronger?  Probably.  But until someone in the sport of football begins to do things that seem impossible, I just can't hop atop the soap box.

I hope these players know the health implications and aren't risking long-term medical stability for short-term financial gain.  (Based on the fact that most athletes can't seem to drive to the grocery store without a blood alcohol level twice the legal limit, I'm doubtful.)  If the league and the Associated Press want to make a serious impact on the lives of these players, how about focusing more attention on protecting the brains of the game's most prized assets?  

Comments

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  • Tough call.

    Cushing basically cheated... unless he's trying to get pregnant.

    He was a monster last year though, but of course you wonder how much of that was the 'roids. Shitty situation, but I think revoting is a bit much.

    How many of these guys do you think roid and don't get caught. I have to believe it's a pretty healthy segment.

  • In reply to MB30SD:

    I had this BIG dude work for me a few summers doing landscaping while he was in college at a top D3 football program. He was a really good HS player, so I asked why he didn't play college ball. He just casually said he didn't want to take roids, like it was no big deal. I think it's a lot more common than most people know.

  • I find it absurd that such items are in someone's contract. There are reasons that prevent yards gained/number of touchdowns/statistics showing up in contracts and putting stuff like this in player's contracts really isn't all that different so I'm not sure why it's even under discussion. It's borderline ridiculous.

    I'm actually surprised that percentage of snaps and the like is actually allowed in there.

    In 1960 the Russian Olympic team got in trouble for using anabolic steroids. In 1961 Mickey Mantle hit 61 home runs. He was hurt for most of the rest of his career. Coincidence?

    Things which are impossible. You think Ricky Henderson was just that much faster than Jackie Robinson? Please.

    The last 50 years are tainted. I agree picking and choosing gets hairy but you have to start setting precedents to deal with this shit sometime. That's the only way these people will be publicly ridiculed or alternatively hailed as awesome risk takers that they are. That shit is dangerous and they throw their body around like deadly missiles, but there's always two sides to every coin. The metaphor breaks down once you consider human beings are not actually pocket change. Though, taking the drugs might be all about the money for some, it might just be to get back on the damn field (see Urlacher, Brian).

    If there were players on the Bears NOT taking PEDs I'd be mildly disappointed.

  • In reply to mikebdot:

    Mantle never hit 61 home runs, that would be Roger Maris; and it took him longer to hit them than Babe... and neither Mantle nor Maris were very big guys. The baseball steroid thing was very apparant, look at Canseco, Bonds, Griffey, Manny, all these guys came into the league like sticks and suddenly after one off-season they are the incredible Hulk; who didn't know they were juicing. But if you are going to start taking away awards you may as well restore records and lets start by giving it back to Maris with the asterisk.

  • In reply to dutsami:

    If a College student gets busted for cheating on finals they get a big fat "F" and face expulsion.

  • In reply to dutsami:

    Yes, Maris. Obviously. MaXXX. Whatever. You got my point! :)

  • In reply to mikebdot:

    I agree. Seems VERY tough to try and "un-ring that bell".

    How about these "Holier than thou" writers doing some IN-HOUSE policing as well?

    TOO MANY so call "Sports Journalists" operate with a complete lack of journalistic ethics. From beat writers in pressers trying to "bait" guys like T.O. into some kind of an outburst to writers just inventing items and floating made-up rumors (are you listing, Mike Florio?) because they're too damn lazy to track down a real story! Nobody in the "Sports Journalism" community says "boo" about that crap.

  • In reply to Albertintucson:

    No kidding Al. Journalism has turned into gossip, ideology and political commentary. Journalist's don't know the difference between reporting and creating a story. The end is near.

  • In reply to ImissButkus:

    This crap has gone on ever since CNN started 24 hour news - the worst thing that has happened to Western civilization in my lifetime.

  • In reply to ImissButkus:

    Isn't everybody on steroids? Leave America and see what normal sized people look like.

    Is Brian Cushing a Chicago Bear now? WTF? Is Dis Da NFL Blog now?

  • In reply to ImissButkus:

    Yeah. What is the story with blog probation? I musta missed a post or thread or something. Can one of you guys who knows the deal with this probation stuff fill us in?

  • In reply to ImissButkus:

    i like the fact that they redid the vote. it would have fucked up in my opinion to just take if from him.

  • In reply to ImissButkus:

    want to be the team that everyone is scared of again. We all look at our schedules and we pick our wins that we legitly know we can win. I want my team to be the team everyone is thinking"..hmm I don't know if we can beat the bears.. they cutler, forte, taylor, urlacher, harris, peppers, tillman, and that Knox and Aroumashado looked really good last year. That is going to be a tough team." DO you really think we are that type of team yet? I want to say yes, you have to be scared because our defense is the hammer and your team is the nail, My team's offense is so good that they make up Chuck Norris Statements about him being scared of Cutler's arm and our running back tandem. I guess, I need to drink so koolaid. Can we be the team that puts fear into others?

  • In reply to ImissButkus:

    Journalism is like anything else. There are pieces of shit and those that do their job well. Engineering is no different. I know some dumb fucking people in my profession.

  • In reply to Albertintucson:

    When your nuts shrivel up and you wipe out your whole family then blow your brains out because of the little voices I guess you have crossed the line GP.

  • In reply to ImissButkus:

    That would be a whole lot funnier if it weren't so darn true.

  • In reply to Albertintucson:

    Urlacher, you must leave Griffey out of the riods conversation or he would have recovered a lot faster and we wouldn't have to worry about Bonds. I agree with the revote cause its only cheating if you get caught. Why would you be stupid enough to take the same thing that Manny got caught for and try to fight it. I think he should have gotten the same 8 games as Pacman just for being stupid. You can't worry about what you can't change but you can change what happens going forward. As always, thx for the soapbox Jeff!

  • In reply to worm0922:

    say hello to the worm

  • In reply to worm0922:

    I'm a jerk.. I know this. However, I'm a jerk with a keyboard. Here is my stance:

    As the great Doug Stanhope once said, "what do you care... you just pay to watch balls fly over your head!"

    Yes, he was referring to baseball - but the same applies. I, as well, would be pissed if no one on the Bears was juicing. I guess they don't really care about winning. All's fair in love and war (see: football).

    I think athletes should do whatever is needed to be stronger, faster, etc... if their heart explodes - they obviously aren't a great athlete. Make room for the next roid monkey.

    I also love the weed testing. The only performance enhancing seen there is competitive eating or tetris playing. If Ricky W. Plays better after a doob, LET HIM!

    You know, oxygen is a performance enhancing drug. Same with calcium, insulin (yeah, I'm looking at you JC), caffeine, and Wheaties in general.

    Draw the line now.

  • In reply to JohnGalt:

    Hey Willie, were you John Gotti's lawyer?

  • In reply to ImissButkus:

    Teflon, baby. Teflon.

    (Also, a performance enhancing drug)

  • In reply to JohnGalt:

    Ricky Williams is my new hero after seeing Run, Ricky, Run. Legend. And still pounding the rock.

  • In reply to worm0922:

    I hear you, worm. The 'roids didn't make McGwire that much more powerful as much as they enabled him to STAY ON THE FIELD and compete. Oakland dumped because his foot problems kept him on the D.L. so much.

  • In reply to worm0922:

    Butkus on 'Roids?

    OMG, Doc.

    Be afraid. Be VERY afraid.

  • In reply to worm0922:

    Hunter Hillenmeyer is definetly not on the juice.

  • In reply to Joseph:

    I give Hunter props, he didn't marry a bimbo.

    http://www.milliehollomanblog.com/images/content/IMG_0525_shannonhunter_millie.jpg

    http://www.milliehollomanblog.com/images/content/IMG_0061_shannonhunter_millie.jpg

    http://www.milliehollomanblog.com/images/content/img_0307_shannonhunter_millie_2.jpg

  • In reply to Joseph:

    Uh-oh, I'm on blog probation.

  • In reply to gpldan:

    huh? What's that GP? They come to your house and slap a GPS anklet on you?

    This website is such dogshit. Jebus.

  • In reply to MB30SD:

    I posted a link below Joseph's comment to Hunter's Hottie Wife. I got the censorship handcuff.

  • In reply to gpldan:

    Bullshit. Let's riot.

  • In reply to gpldan:

    Dude, he was just trying to get pregnant, leave the poor guy alone: http://msn.foxsports.com/video?vid=f04591df-5554-4208-a8db-bf084097510d&from=foxsports_en-us_videocentral

  • In reply to gpldan:

    Ho Hum.

  • In reply to gpldan:

    I finally figured out this must be the MB and Jeff show. Jeff scratches himself and drops a new thread every 4 days and MB flaps his proverbial computer gum's to keep us entertained until Jeff scratches himself again. Can we get a new act?

  • In reply to ImissButkus:

    Three months and one day until pre-season, Trac. Hang in there.

  • In reply to IrishBearsFan:

    Threeeeeeeeeee Moooooooonthhhhs.

  • In reply to ImissButkus:

    Go Bears!! Go Blackhawks!! Go Lebron and Wade to Da Bulls!! Why do we have a baseball team here much less two?

  • In reply to ImissButkus:

    Grass it is.

    Bears President Ted Phillips recently met with Chicago Park District general superintendent Tim Mitchell about the possibility of converting the field from grass to an artificial surface, but there are no plans to do so this year.

    The Park District was interested in changing the surface

  • In reply to mikemuadib:

    I don't get it. The place is owned by the Park District - who cares what the Bears think? How many other teams don't own their own stadiums by the way?

  • In reply to IrishBearsFan:

    Don't the Bears own it and the Park District does the maintenance of it?

  • In reply to mikemuadib:

    As far as I know, the Bears only rent it occasionally to play games on. Isn't it a listed building and owned by the district?

  • In reply to IrishBearsFan:

    I think that's why they couldn't build a statue to Wally there, wasn't Bears property.

  • In reply to IrishBearsFan:

    Profile in ignorance:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5U4tI_qzyH0&feature=youtube_gdata

    Having Eric Holder as U.S. Attorney General is akin to having the Mccaskeys own the Bears.

  • In reply to Albertintucson:

    I do remember a time Albert when Country not party rhetoric took precedence because our school systems actually taught the Constitution in proper historical context instead of political dogma. I can definitely see a parallel Albert.

  • In reply to ImissButkus:

    Well, you must be an old fart, like me, Trac, who remembers when people immgrated to this country to become AMERICANS and embrace AMERICAN culture. Now every body has to be a "Hyphenated" American and have all the traditions, culture and languages of their birthplace amended into the U.S. Constitution.

    Screw A.G. Eric Holder for commenting and critizing on the Arizona bill HE HAD NOT EVEN READ, just like most of the idiotic protesteors and boycott proponents!

    And while I'm on this oparticular rant...this latest Supreme Court nominee is an absolute INSULT to the American public as she is wholly UNQUALIFIED!
    I have more qualifcations to be HEAD COACH OF THE BEARS than she has to sit on the Supreme Court of the United States and I am definitely NOT qualified to be a head coach!

    See how I craftily sneaked a Sports/Bears refernce into this post?

  • In reply to Albertintucson:

    I see how you did that Albert.

  • In reply to Albertintucson:

    Why Al? Because she's never been a judge before? The majority of Supreme Court Justices never were judges before taking the bench.

    She has recieved rave reviews from the left and right regarding her ability to understand and argue the pertinent law in the most important and complex cases in the highest court as solicitor general.

    She was the Dean of Harvard Law School, and was known for being able to bring together a very politically divisive staff to work on solving issues. She was praised for having this mediator type quality at the U of Chicago Law School as well. This is a great quality to have for a new member of the bench. She has strong advocates from both sides and is definitely more impartial and in the middle than Sotomayor.

    Her academic and work experience is almost impeccable, including clerkships with the great US Court of Appeals judge Abner Mikva and Supreme Court Justice Thurgood Marshall.

    Kagan is undoubetdly well qualified in my opinion to be on the bench. Based on her photos, she is also well qualified to shore up the left gaurd position for the Bears for years to come. I would take her over Schaeffer because she can bend better.

  • In reply to Crown:

    Sign Kagan!! If she can work in the shotgun I think she may be a good center one day.

  • In reply to Crown:

    A Supreme Court Judge wih no prior experience as a Judge.

    What a concept!

    Then we try Schaeffer at punt returns while she fills at guard.

    Thanks, but no thanks.

    And, sorry, but "Harvard Academic" is not a an asset as far as I am concerned.

    Plus, she's never been married so likely has no clue about how real life works out side the safe little realm of her career.

    She's another version of the "totally unqualified for her important job" Janet Napolitano. Crown her ass if you like, but not as a Supreme Court justice.

  • In reply to Albertintucson:

    And let's save time, blog space and enmity, Crown. There is nothing you can say that will convince me this woman should be on the Supreme Court at this point in time and I will concede that that there is nothing I can say to you to convince you that she should not be.

  • In reply to Albertintucson:

    Alright Al. Fuck the Fudgepackers then.

  • In reply to Crown:

    They don't belong on the Supreme Court either!

    Well, maybe the CHEESE supreme court.

  • In reply to Crown:

    For the purpose of raising the comment count...

    Can we get a safety already?

    LOL. Bear down. Go bears.

  • In reply to JohnGalt:

    Who you trying to conjure up Who? LOL

  • In reply to JohnGalt:

    Can't expect much to happen now until June 1 when the unsigned restricted free agents, like Atogwe, become UNrestricted free agents.

  • In reply to Albertintucson:

    June 1st - when we'll do jack shit about Atogwe becasus the piggy bank is empty.

  • In reply to JohnGalt:

    Not sure if someone else posted this but I thought it would help some of us with the cover 2 assignments for our players. Seems the Key to our D will be a healthy and energized Urlacher and a quick, strong and aggressive front D line.(Peppers and Butter). If these two area's are executed the way they are supposed to then our D will have a chance to rock.

    http://beargoggleson.com/2010/05/14/how-the-2010-bears-fit-the-cover-2/

  • In reply to ImissButkus:

    Yup. If Pep and Butters get it on, and Urlacher drops back quickly and things are sweet with him, the Cover two will be awesome this year.

    Beekman to center, start Lance Louis and Asiata at guard from week one, and we could really be rolling come the end of the regular season.

  • In reply to IrishBearsFan:

    while we are switching out center and guards, can we please put Shaffer in at right tackle. way to many people seem ok with the idea of Omiyale starting.

  • In reply to luftwaffle:

    Definitely Shaeffer over Omelette, but maybe Asiata/Louis over Sheffer if they're keeping the middle three where they are. They have upside, Shaeffer doesn't. But it's definitely time to break the omelette.

  • In reply to ImissButkus:

    Im sure Peppers will do alright. Its Urlacher, missing a full season, and the year before having the least productive season of his career. AHHH Harris, dont know what he has left to give, and how long and how much he can play. I hope we are better at other positions, rather than being dependent on those two.

  • In reply to ImissButkus:

    I cant wait for camp to start so we have more football to blog about.

  • In reply to iamndmurff:

    Nice pic Murph. The little devil looks like a killer!!

  • In reply to CanadaBear:

    Hey Canada, actually that one can barely chew a biscuit, have another one can rip flesh, big time!

  • In reply to iamndmurff:

    I've got a 10 lb bundle of joy. Can't beat them for great companions. I prefer the harmless ones.

  • In reply to CanadaBear:

    congrats Canada!

  • In reply to hollywood1:

    It's a canine bundle of joy but thanks anyway!

  • In reply to CanadaBear:

    http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/05/16/hope-or-delusion-descends-on-halas-hall/
    This article discusses the Delusion our Fearless leaders at Hallas Hall. I hope they've got it wrong.

  • In reply to ImissButkus:

    From the article : D. Hester :

    "Our offense is really built around giving the receivers opportunities to make plays," Hester said. "It's all up to the receivers. We have a big role this season to step up and make plays. I think our group has a good chance to shock a lot of people."

    Oh dear. Shocking could be the very word. Interesting to hear that Martz wants Bulger and has raved about Hanie ... meaning he thinks we should cut Pepe if we're carrying 3 QBs.

  • In reply to ImissButkus:

    We signed J'Marcus Webb to a Four year deal . Does it mean we have a starter?

  • In reply to Bears85Sweetness23:

    that sure would be nice

  • In reply to Bears85Sweetness23:

    Webb's Scouting report. http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/players/1620417

  • In reply to Bears85Sweetness23:

    So, the AP football writers got all huffy and indignant about Brian Cushing getting busted for using a banned substance and decided to hold a re-vote NFL Defensive Rookie of the year award.

    Then, they promptly voted it to Brian Cushing for a second time.

    Huh?

    Pardon my density but someone is going to have to explain to me how that doesn't make the AP football writers look absolutely ridiculous.

  • In reply to Albertintucson:

    This is the collective game society plays. We all like modern medicine and pharm, we cheer because it heals and pumps up our favorite gladiators to make even more spectacular plays. Sayers and Butkus could have both extended the playing days by YEARS with modern medicine and surgery.

    But then, of course, we're supposed to give the APPEARANCE of being appalled by the side effects of steroids and their use. We delude ourselves into asking why it can't all come about "naturally", as if there is much left that is "natural" about a modern athlete's life anymore.

  • In reply to gpldan:

    +1
    Let them all take steroids, the Olympics too. If we want fairness and a level playing field that is ...

  • In reply to Bears85Sweetness23:

    Certainly won't be starting this year if ever - he's got to beat out Omelette, Shaeffer, (and potentially Asiata/Louis, both of whom are big and strong enough to play tackle)

    His work ethic and low intelligence were called out in the scouting report :

    Negatives: Project player. Has all of the physical tools but work ethic and intelligence are major issues. Bad body language at Texas vs. the Nation practices turned off teams, but he turned on his game on for a few seconds once the ball was snapped and looked like a player. Played at Texas, had to transfer to JUCO then West Texas A&M.

  • In reply to IrishBearsFan:

    Justin Smiley could be on the loose soon too. He would have been a better signing than Webb, we have a ton of guys at the ready to jump in and play RT already. What's so special about some dude that we picked in the 7th round? Dumb and lazy is all I've read about him so far.

  • In reply to IrishBearsFan:

    Sorry guys, turn from football and lets hear a moment of silence on be have of Ronnie James Dio and a commemory you tube...

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1eTAzYjbKm4

  • In reply to shonbear:

    Not a huge fan of the music but that little guy had a set of pipes!

  • In reply to Bears85Sweetness23:

    No, he will probably just be on the practice squad.

  • In reply to ImissButkus:

    Backup to the backup tackle if he can grasp the playbook.

  • In reply to ImissButkus:

    Stupid and strong can be serviceable at LG, as Kreutz would be there to slap the helmet when he missed the blitz pickup.

    Stupid AND lazy? Welcome to Mcdonalds, how may I serve you?

  • In reply to gpldan:

    Who slaps Kreutz on the head this year as he misses more and more stuff?

  • In reply to ImissButkus:

    fuck Peter King. glad he didn't say we were going to the Bowl; but having us 25th? i'ma ride his ass all fuckin' season on twitter....please believe it.

    http://bit.ly/bDnZ3t

  • In reply to FQD1911:

    That dickhole, what a hack. I'm with ya on the Twitter scolding, i'm gonna terrorize him all day long.

  • In reply to Joseph:

    what's your twitter guy? (@FQD1911)

  • In reply to FQD1911:

    @scholarbuysjb

  • In reply to Joseph:

    That is my work account, I can't get too crazy on there.

  • In reply to FQD1911:

    Ride Olsen into the ground for me.I swore I'd never tweet. That attack where Ashton Kuchter and his army of cleb dooshettes lost their 'followers' was genius. My heart bleeds for Tori Spelling knowing that for a couple of days her legion of 'followers' didn't know when she was taking a shit.

  • In reply to Joseph:

    2 quick reactions from previous comments as this is what I do for a living.

    Irish, in response to the currency control issue, that simply means that Congress is the only way that can manipulate the money SUPPLY. Private banks cannot and are not doing so. If you are referring to lending as a means to control currency, that is a much different story.

    And yes, 100% correct about FDIC. Currently, the FDIC is in the negative. Thats right, they are in the red.

    If one major bank (chase, citi, boa, etc) went belly up there is not even close to enough on reserve. Typically the FDIC carries about 40 billion in reserve. Most mid size banks have well over that on deposit. Also, they can take up to 20 years to pay it back...This is why I always get a kick out of people who will only "invest" in FDIC backed instruments.

  • In reply to Dmband:

    Dude. Look at a bank note. Any note. What does it say? Federal Reserve Note. Also not backed by gold i.e. basically worthless, just a piece of paper and with every devaluation is approximating the same worth Check out the Federal Reserve act of 1913 that was passed with THREE members of congress on the floor (day after Christmas). The Federal Reserve ARE private banks : 1. Rothschild Banks of London and Berlin
    2. Lazard Brothers Bank of Paris
    3. Israel Moses Sieff Banks of Italy
    4. Warburg Bank of Hamburg, Germany and Amsterdam
    5. Kuhn Loeb Bank of New York
    6. Lehman Brothers Bank of New York
    7. Goldman Sachs Bank of New York
    8. Chase Manhattan Bank of New York (Controlled By Rockefellers)

    This is how they get away with it. People see 'Federal Reserve' and a big fancy building and they think U'S' Government owned. Not so. people need to wake up and realise there's no need for this and that they're basically slaves for no good reason. It can stop. It must stop. Shut doen the Fed. Write to your congressman and demand it. If everybody did that you might have a chance of beating them.

  • In reply to Joseph:

    Also, I have to completely disagree regarding the tax issue Irish. Sure, we could all stop paying taxes, however I actually like Schools, roads, police and fire departments, libraries, etc.

    Lets not lose sight of the fact that they are a very necessary part of a full functioning society.

  • In reply to Dmband:

    You weren't readin, man. Your income tax is not used to build roads, schools etc. Those things are paid for by all the other indirect taxes, that's the point. That shit is already paid for! Income tax, every penny of it gets used in servicing the intereset on the debt they owe to the federal reserve. The government asks the Fed to print a million dollars, they have to pay back the Fed a buck thirty three or whatever. Your roads are paid for by the road taxes etc. not income tax. They use your tax to pay off a debt that doesn't need to be there -doesn't that make you mad as hell? look at all the bullshit taxes you get hit with :
    http://www.taxfoundation.org/files/sr151.pdf

    Why? Because everything else goes straight into the pockets of the dudes at the top of the food chain in that small handful of banks. Period. Spread the word.

  • In reply to IrishBearsFan:

    I hate to throw a monkey wrench into this great debate Irish but the reason things are the way they are is because the proper biblical context of our constitution has been undermined by politicians and sadly, Churches that teach error. The first Bible printed in this nation was printed by the 1st Continental Congress specifically for the instruction and teaching of Christianity in our public school systems. Take Christianity out of the constitution and you end up with the blind leading the blind. Businesses and our government used to be guided by Christian principles and that is where this Nation went astray because the authority of the scriptures has been slowly eroded over the last 70 years. Jesus said a house divided cannot stand.

  • In reply to ImissButkus:

    If you want to get into the Bible, Jesus cleared th temple of moneylenders, and so should we. Keep
    'banks' local, let people lend money to each other.

    Things are the way they are because the greatest fraud in American History occurred when the federal Reserve act of 1913 took the control of money away from the people and put into the hands of Shylocks, private banks. By a vote of two to one! Two PEOPLE that is. TWO PEOPLE VOTED AGAINST ONE PERSON ON THE FLOOR! Look this up. The 'Federal Reserve' is a cartel of private banks - when are people going to wake up and understand this? The American people are bankrupt because they are paying interest to use their own money! It's insane. Congress can stop it tomorrow but congress and the fed and the military industrial congress are all in this together! You're being screwed and have been screwed for close on a hundred years in 2013! This is a three card monty and Americans need to wake the fuck up! Timothy Geithner was President of the Fed (the people's enemy) and then goes straight inot the job aof Secretary of the Treasury! Doesn't anyone get how insanely and obviously corrupt that is? Ron Paul gets it. Democrats probably switch off when Ron Paul speaks just because he's a Republican. I'm neither. They're all wholding hands with the Devil at hte end of the day and don't give a crap about you. I'm outside the red/blue ridiculous divide. As Bill Hicks said, it's the same beast holding up the two sock puppets.

    "Give me control of a nation's currency and I care not who makes its laws."
    ~Meyer Amschel Rothschild

    "If the American people ever allow the banks to control the issuance of their currency ... the banks and corporations that will grow up around them will deprive the people of all property, until their children wake up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered."
    ~ Thomas Jefferson

    "I sincerely believe that banking institutions having the issuing power of money, is more dangerous to liberty than standing armies."
    ~ Thomas Jefferson

    "The government should create, issue, and circulate all currency. Creating and issuing money is the supreme prerogative of government and its greatest creative opportunity. Adopting these principles will save the taxpayers immense sums of interest and money will cease to be the master and become the servant of humanity."
    ~ Abraham Lincoln

  • In reply to Dmband:

    Apologies to all fellow bloggers who just want their football. Let 'The Brian Cushing Precedent' just be the thread where we got this stuff off our chest. Okay, me then. I don't think Big Brother will be looking for us here ;o) Just makes me angry, can't believe people put up with this shit.

  • In reply to ImissButkus:

    No offense, Trac, but SCREW "Make-It-Up" Mike Florio and the horse he road in on. This guy should have been given his walking papers when he went on the Dan Patrick show and ADMITTED, quite flippantly I might, as if it was perfectly acceptable for him to do it, that he had MADE UP the item about Randy Moss wanting out of New England early last season.

    I said it before but it "Bears" repeating, the bulk of the national media is rooting for the Bears to fail because they all WHIFFED on who was going where at the start of free agency. Angelo had basically said the Bears weren't going to be very active and then WHAM, he swooped in and stole most of the thunder by signing two of the biggest FAs available which left so many "insiders' and "experts" with egg on their face.

    Can you name 1 national NFL pundit who had Peppers going to Chicago?

  • In reply to Albertintucson:

    I honestly think we know more about our own team than these flakes. Hub Arkush hat it 'on good authority from the top level' that Lovie was gone last season and Cowher was in. No one ever calls them on it when they're wrong, I don't pay them any heed. Angelo was pretty spot on when he said we wouldn't be very active - we got three players. The cash was irrelevant. Having said that, there's a lot to like about the dudes we did get. And I'm slowly coming around to thinking that between Asiata/Louis and Beekman we've got a solid middle three - backups or whatever. Apparently Kreutz's Achilles job was just removing a bone spur and had nothing to do with his tendon, which is good news. Slot Manu in there with Kellen Davis and that could be a formidable wall. Louis might be a better option than Shaeffer at tackle though - he pulls well and is an animal in space according to his reports, catches the ball. Asiata sounds promising too, smart guy, tough, he could cover Beekman and Garza at guard. Still like to see a pro vet safety and receiver though ...

  • In reply to IrishBearsFan:

    Bottom line, this team has a history of not meeting expectations either way. I "hope" this year we actually have a fighting chance until the final whistle.

  • In reply to iamndmurff:

    Larry Mayer is a huge douche. The more i read the milktoast/softball questions he fields on the site the angrier i get. I don't know who i'm more pissed at, him or the tools that write the questions.

  • In reply to hollywood1:

    I'll bet he writes them himself. That's probably his real job.

  • In reply to Albertintucson:

    If appointments that should worry people is the conversation then look a lot higher. Once Timothy Geithner, the CEO of the Federal Reserve Bank of New York became United States Secretary of the Treasury, any arguments as to who was running the country became moot. America is run by Timothy Geithner, and every single American is a slave to paying off a debt that can't be paid off. Every dollar that is printed means the government must pay back a buck thirty three. Not hard to see how America is in the shitter. It's happening in Europe with the Euro. Who's not in the Euro? The Bank of Fucking England. They're in this scam with the Federal Reserve.

    "If the American people ever allow the banks to control the issuance of their currency ... the banks and corporations that will grow up around them will deprive the people of all propert, until their children wake up homeless on the continent their fathers conquerered."
    ~ Thomas Jefferson

    "I sincerely believe that banking institutions having the issuing power of money, is more dangerous to liberty than standing armies."
    ~ Thomas Jefferson

    "The government should create, issue, and circulate all currency. Creating and issuing money is the supreme prerogative of government anf its gretaest creative opportunity. Adopting these principles will save the taxpayers immense sums of interest and money will cease to be the master and become the servant of humanity."
    ~ Abraham Lincoln

    "Who controls the food controls the people; who controls energy can control whole continents ; who controls money controls the world."
    ~ Henry Kissinger

    "The bankers own the earth. Take it away from them, but leave them the power to create money, and with the flick of the pen they will create enough money to buy it back again. However, take away from them the power to create money, and all the great fortunes like mine will disappear and they ought to disappear, for this would be a happier and better world to live in. But, if you wish to remain the slaves of bankers and pay the cost of your own slavery, let them continue to create money."
    ~ Sir Josiah Stamp, Former Director of the Bank of England

    "We are greatful to the Washington Post, the NY Times, Time Magazine, and other great publications whose directors have attended our meetings and respected their promises of discretion for almost 40 years. It would have been impossible for us to develop our plan for the world if we had been subjected to the light of publicity during those years. But now the world is more sophisticated and prepared to march towards a world government. The supra national sovereignty of an intellectual elite and world bankers is surely preferable to the national auto-determination practiced in past centuries."
    ~ David Rockefeller, Private Banker, Council on Foreign Relations, 1991

    "The Constitution is just a goddamn piece of paper."
    ~ George W. Bush, 2005.

  • In reply to IrishBearsFan:

    Not football related, I know. But a whole lot more important than Brian Cushing's muscles. You don't have to file tax returns, so don't do it. When they drag you into court ask them to show you the law that the Supreme Courts twice refused to legislate. That's why they don't want a Judge as head of the Supreme Court - they don't want anyone knowing that Americans are being screwed every day. The Congress has the power to shut down the Fed. Reserve and make America healthy overnight. Why aren't they doing that? Why are a handful of people getting super rich off your backs? End it now. Don't vote for any member of congress until they sign an affidavit saying they'll shut down the Fed. God Bless America. R.I.P. Aaron Russo.

  • In reply to IrishBearsFan:

    Snipes won that part of his trial Irish unfortunately he had lied to the Feds which is what he got sent up the creek for. Bottom line is if they want to get you they will.

  • In reply to ImissButkus:

    Yup.

  • In reply to IrishBearsFan:

    I agree waffle. Don't know why I bother to read them sometimes.

  • In reply to IrishBearsFan:

    Well gents, I think it's safe to say we probably won't see any more Roster changes of note. It would be great to see a couple of new pro bowlers on this team. If Cutler can play well he could be a shoe in.

  • In reply to ImissButkus:

    Over dinner Jeff Ireland might ask Brandon Marshall if his mother takes it up the blind side ... we could still trade for him ...

  • In reply to IrishBearsFan:

    Good one!

  • In reply to IrishBearsFan:

    Like it or not but the Constitution can only be applied the way our founders intended if God and Christianity leads the thought process when reading it. Why do you think so many people rail against Christianity? This is not by accident and this country will either die on the vine or wake up.

  • In reply to ImissButkus:

    The Constitution isn't the Bible, though. The Bible and the Koran get interpreted. The Bible is clearly insane in some parts. According to the Bible, anyone working on the sabbath should be put to death, also women who wear more than three threads in their clothing. The Constitution clearly states that only Congress should print and supply currency. In no way does a private cartel of banks constitute Congress. it's the clears-as-crystal bits that are being over-run and nobody is doing a thing about it. Ron Paul tries, but people are not asking enough of congress. Shut down the Federal Reserve (which Congress have the authority to do) and America is saved. If they won't help then revolt. Plain and simple.

  • In reply to Albertintucson:

    All old farts line up to the right. If you all remember when we were happy to be 7-9 line up on the right. If you couldnt help but like Abe Gibron,line up to the right.

  • In reply to iamndmurff:

    Abe stayed around as long as he did because the the local Bear writers at the time loved the guy (and his famous BBQs). If you have not seen it, the feature on Abe in THE COMPLETE HISTORY OF THE CHICAGO BEARS DVD set is definitely REQUIRED bear fan viewing!

  • In reply to Albertintucson:

    http://img.moronail.net/img/9/3/4793.jpg

  • In reply to Albertintucson:

    http://img.moronail.net/img/0/9/4809.jpg

  • In reply to iamndmurff:

    Hmm. I see Notre Dame and Miami U. are contemplating a game at SOLDIER FIELD in 2012.

    I forget, does the Mayan calender have the world ending BEFORE or AFTER the college football season?

  • In reply to Albertintucson:

    Cool, somebody mentioned the constitution. Did you know ...

    Only congress can supply and control currency according to the U.S. Constitution - yet here we are with a cartel of private banks doing so.

    The U.S. Supreme courts have ruled, twice, that the sixteenth amendment to the constitution mad no provision for any new kinds of taxation! Congress tried to introduce an income tax in 1894 and the Supreme courts ruled it unconstitutional. They tried again in 1913 and again it was ruled unconstitutional. If it was unconstitutional then, it's unconstitutional now. There is no law which requires American citizens to file tax returns!

    Go Bears!

  • In reply to IrishBearsFan:

    So the IRS are bully-boys collecting an unconstitutional tax for an unconstitutional cartel. Any military out there? You swore an oath to uphold the constitution, not form the New World Order. Shut down the Federal Reserve and take back control of your country, that would be a justified coup.

  • In reply to IrishBearsFan:

    My number one argument against Kagan is the fact that she kicked off Rotc and tried to prevent military recruiters from Harvard. Makes my stomach turn. The supreme court ruled unanimously against her actions. Socialism is the enemy of freedom.

  • In reply to IrishBearsFan:

    Stick to football Irish, your understanding of the Constitution and Supreme court rulings is flawed and incomplete. Love most of the other crazy shit you write.

  • In reply to iamndmurff:

    Which part was flawed Murph? There is no law in the U.S. Constitution that requires you to file tax returns. (Whitey Halley vs Illinois). And only Congress is allowed to supply currency according to the U.S. Constitution - yet the Fed have been doing it since 1913. They're the only two points I'm interested in. Your freedoms all disappeared with the homeland security and Patriot acts. They had jack shit to do with terrorism and everything to do with becoming a totalitarian state. It's time to wake up. There should be blood on the streets. Aaron Russo - the guy that brought us Trading Places - made a very frightening documentary that everyone should see - America : Freedom to Fascism. Don't be put off by the title, he's not some reactionary nut. Watching that film will chill your bones, especially the RFID chips. Watch out for those my friends.

    It would be in the Bank's best interests not to allow an off-season, it just gets people talking ...

  • In reply to IrishBearsFan:

    "America : Freedom to Fascism" changed my life Irish, along with "Loose Change."
    +1

  • In reply to Church:

    Scared the effing crap out of me man. I'm not an 'America-hater' - I love everything about it apart from those assholes that try - and are succeeding - in taking away your freedoms and running up your national debt senselessly. George W made the military his own private plaything with the flick of a pen, That's not on. The President can decide to go to war on a whim. All on his own? The way he got to do that was disgusting when you consider the implications of 9/11. The bigger the lie you tell the more people will believe it. If you liked Loose Change, 'In Plane sight' was way better. God Bless America.

    I just hope we win a superbowl before our minds get wiped.

  • In reply to IrishBearsFan:

    Tell em about the "Gold Standard" Irish. If people knew how little cash banks have on reserve they would think twice about the bogus FDIC insurance that is a lie and a joke. The money is not there and the insurance is a scam.

  • In reply to ImissButkus:

    Agree 100% Trac. Whether the Fed walked out of Fort Knox with it 80 years ago or whether it is actually there but they're just 'looking after it' the point is moot. It doesn't belong to Americans anymore and questions not only need to be asked but heads must roll. In 2006, the American Dollar was worth 4 cents in line with 'inflation'. Inflation just means that the more 'imaginary money' they keep printing up, the less the dollar is worth. That's why your great-great-great Grandaddy's candy bar was a penny and now its $12.95. Ron Paul schools Bernanke again : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8pEiLHnjAiw

    The country has been bankrupt since 1933 and has been operating under Emergency War Powers ever since (http://www.halexandria.org/dward284.htm). They never repealed it! There was a big report and hoo-ha in 1973 to remind people that it had been in effect for forty years and did people take the blindest bit of notice? http://www.barefootsworld.net/war_ep1.html!

    Incredible stuff. School children should be reminded of this every day at assembly. These things are all fixable. Just like the Bears. See how I did that?

  • In reply to ImissButkus:

    In 2006, the U.S. Dollar was worth 4 cents in real value compared to what a dollar bought when it was backed by gold and not 'legal tender' which is jargon for 'worthless'. There's a reason your great-great-grand-daddy's candy bar cost a penny and now costs $19.99 The dollar gets more and more worthles the more of thsi 'imaginary money' they print up. After the recent $800 Billion dollars that got printed out of thin air, how much is the dollar really worth now? Obama actually stood there with a straight face saying it was to 'stimulate the economy'. What a putz.

    Listen to Bernanke's voice after Ron Paul schools him on printing imaginary money :

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8pEiLHnjAiw

  • In reply to IrishBearsFan:

    By the way, after George W. Bush enabled the Presidency to go to war with the say so of one man ... and Obama is the first U.S. President to be 100% Wall Street backed .. it follows that the Fed call the shots militarily and military people swore an oath to uphold the constitution of the USA, not David Rockefeller and his buddies.

  • In reply to IrishBearsFan:

    Football !!

    What in the name of Daisy Marie is Shane Day (Xerox boy) talking to Jay Cutler about in the following photo ?

    http://www.chicagobears.com/news/NewsStory.asp?story_id=6775
    (Bears rookies join veterans on practice field for first time)

    Please. Honestly. Explain it to me. What could he possibly be talking to Cutler about? this guy is Milhouse.

    "Did you see 'Lost' last night? The smoke monster is Jacob's brother! Awesome!"

    Seriously - look at this guy !
    http://bleacherreport.com/articles/339534-jay-cutler-meet-shane-day-he-could-be-your-new-quarterback-caddy

    Picture this guy in short trousers back in the day, stuttering and stammering through his retainer, years of wedgies and dead arms, going home in tears to his mommy, begging her not to send him back to school. This is the guy we hire to get inside Cutler's head? I get that Jimmy Mac doesn't want a job like this. I get that we don't need/can't have a Lombardi winner, or even a pro-bowler to guide Jay through the maze of his mind. But the guy that used to staple the Niners' play-books together? Please explain this to me... or I'll bring up the Emergency War Powers having never been repealed after its 1933 enactment. Shane Day. Why?

  • In reply to IrishBearsFan:

    I think he is saying:
    "uhhm, you guys are like, tall and stuff heh heh"

  • In reply to IrishBearsFan:

    nice, thanks for sharing!

  • In reply to IrishBearsFan:

    If a tree falls in the forest and nobody is there to see it, did it really fall?

  • In reply to IrishBearsFan:

    As a fan of Steve Czaban, I hold Mr. King in low regard, as well. Czabe periodically hauls out some of Peter's work and uses it to dispaly King's ineptitude.

    It is mind-numbing stupidity that Fox Radio dumped the very entertaining Steve Czaban show and gave the time slot to Stephan A. Smith, who, while I will hgrant is knowledgeable on the NBA (Zzzzz) is otherwise UNlistenable.

  • In reply to IrishBearsFan:

    Irish,

    I come here to NOT think about this nonsense.

    Yes, it's ridiculous. Yes, I wish it wasn't how it is.

    No, I can't do a thing.

    Yes, I'll focus on football...

    Yes, the defeatist attitude is what gets us to where we are now. No, I won't pretend (any longer) that I could make a change.

    Russo makes a movie. 2% of the population sees it. 1% believes it...

    Nothing changes.

    Sorry.

    Wish I could help.

  • In reply to JohnGalt:

    Sad but true Willie, sad but true.

  • In reply to mikemuadib:

    Park district owns it and maintains it. The Bears have a lease-rental agreement.

  • In reply to iamndmurff:

    How would you guys feel about moving to our own stadium?

  • In reply to mikemuadib:

    Mike Martz and the Greatest Show on Inch Deep Mud mixed with grass clippings and sand!

  • In reply to gpldan:

    How much does this mess with Martz' masterplan, really?

  • In reply to mikemuadib:

    what do the preliminary findings say about injuries on loose sod. running in mud and clumps of grass cant be safer than field turf

  • In reply to ImissButkus:

    Hmmmmmm... I'm onto you trac, you're just trying to throw us off your smelly scented trail. I've said it before.... YOU are Kaiser Sosei.

    And I think Lobo is the puppet master of it all. Charlieeeeeee!

  • In reply to MB30SD:

    Forgive me MB, I can't take this boredom anymore. This is the longest off season ever. Maybe that's a good thing.

  • In reply to ImissButkus:

    Not needed trac. I get you're just trying to have fun man. Off season sucks.

  • In reply to gpldan:

    Wow. Censorship. A player's wife is off-limits I guess, fair enough. At least we can have opinions and drop f-bombs unlike most other blogs, that's why I come here. The last bastion of the freedom to speak- DBB! But hands off Hunter's hottie. Now, Google ...

  • In reply to mikebdot:

    What is a steroid anyway? HGH, testosterone doping, drugs to increase strength for short durations that only rely on amino acid infux from the liver, vitamin B12 shots.

    Where does the line lie?

  • I'm pretty glad it went down this way: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2010/football/nfl/05/12/cushing.ap/index.html?eref=sihp

  • 2002 Jalepeno was defensive roy and he was suspended for the same shit. Should we go back and re-vote that one too?

    My hope is that the cheese eating, fudge packing sonovabich Mathews doesn't win it this time around. He's good but the les accolades those douchebags win the better.

    Remember a bunch of years ago Jim Fucking Miller was suspended for peds? That is probably a good indication as to how widespread these things are in the league right now. Lots of tiny testicles in NFL locker rooms...

  • moot point and all...

  • Too much.........really? Go ask an NFL player that loses his job to one of these steroid shooting cheaters. Or better yet, go ask a player who got their career ended by a juiced up player that was able to deliver a career ending blow because of the added strength from the steroids. I say kick the bums out of the league. It's one thing to take a substance that has an ingredient that is banned but it's a totally different category when a player goes all out with the steroids to achieve super human strength by "CHEATING".

  • In reply to ImissButkus:

    Word up. If there were no steroids in the league there would be a thousand different faces in the NFL. Imagine all the talent that never quite made it in the league - or worse still never even made it to the NFL - because they wouldn't juice up, because they were honest and righteous. Masking agents and cycling keep you one step ahead of the testers - Brian Cushing got caught ergo he's an idiot. Is anyone under the illusion that juicing is anything other than the norm in the NFL? Look at those f*ckers! Look at the size of them! You think it's not happening on the Bears? Urlacher used to be a safety, now he's built like Ben Grimm. Go figure. Doing weights only does so much as anyone who's ever done time as a gym rat will testify to. The propensity for pro footballers to rape and assault is no doubt a direct link. The NFL isn't fooling anybody, they're not serious about taking it out of the sport. They're no more serious baout that then the govt is about keeping illegals out -whose going to mow your lawns? They could stop drug-taking tomorrow if they really wanted to, just like the U.S. Government could stop illegals crossing over from Mexico if they really wanted to (it's called a really big fucking wall). If you can put laser stations in space and keep standing armies all over the world, you can build a big wall. Where there's a will there's a way. A one strike and you're out policy would have players dropping 'roids like a hot rod and have them checking those ingredients real close with their reading glasses on. Problem solved. 'Cept that's not good for business. We want our gladiators buff. Right?

  • In reply to IrishBearsFan:

    100% Irish. 100%.

  • I saw how you did that doc.

  • Funny guy Doc. I like.

  • Sometimes on the blog when you post, you get a message saying your comment is being held for moderation. I think it's a random thing that I don't get much, but it happens. Can make you quite paranoid depending on what you'd just written. I just ignore it now and refresh to see if it's posted whatever crap I've just typed.

  • In reply to IrishBearsFan:

    #16 - you mean Blogfather 2 - Noah? Tumbled by the Irish.

  • In reply to IrishBearsFan:

    By the bye, in case anyone missed the end of the last thread - we might be okay for guards. Come back Lobo (with Ditka avatar this time) there may be redemption for our beloved roid-guzzling Bears this season. Lance Louis and Kiwi Asiata. Bear the frak down brethern, if Tice works some magic we could be steam-rolling by mid-season, a juggernaut that might not stop until Lombardi nombre deux. That means 'super bowl' for any Fudgepackin'/BiQueen lurkers ...

  • In reply to IrishBearsFan:

    Can you imagine what we would have been like with Brandon Marshall? I said I'd let the BM thing go. I lied.

  • In reply to IrishBearsFan:

    Boldin on the other side? Any taker? Fuuuuuuck: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q8WjHHT0JzA

  • In reply to IrishBearsFan:

    Me too Irish, but I figured out how to make me get over it.IF Brandon gets in trouble one more time, he is out of the nfl.. forever. I don't think he is worth my time and effort if just one screw up and he is out. Boldin on the other hand.. would have been nice

  • In reply to IrishBearsFan:

    Ok Jeff, please give us your next thought. This is a waste of time.

  • In reply to IrishBearsFan:

    Correction, all this is a waste of time but it's all moot I guess.

  • In reply to IrishBearsFan:

    LT was just playin' a little Wii Sports, ya see? He's really a good guy.

    http://www.nydailynews.com/news/ny_crime/2010/05/12/2010-05-12_lt_touched_himself_not_16yrold_sez_her_pal.html

  • In reply to IrishBearsFan:

    Sami Salo, the Canuck defenseman, apparently had a ruptured testicle after getting hit with a slapshot in the Blackhawks playoff series.

    He took a shot to the groin and came out for the next game. The Chicago fans started chanting "Balls of Steel!"

    nice.

  • In reply to gpldan:

    YEEEOOW!

    Talk about "Takin' one for the team" !!!!

    So much for the so-called "protection" offered by wearing a cup.

    I believe former Bear corner, Virgil Livers, gave one up for the team as well.

  • In reply to Albertintucson:

    Canucks also have the worst uniform in hockey history, no small feat

    http://cdn.bleacherreport.net/images_root/slides/photos/000/221/339/canucks_display_image.jpg?1273459888

  • In reply to gpldan:

    Lance Briggs has been awarded 2nd team All-Pro on the revote.

  • Doc, please please please... things around here just started getting back to normal and pleasant.

    Let's let sleeping turds lie. (Oh, yeah, I said it. I know Willie is with me)

  • In reply to MB30SD:

    +16

  • In reply to JohnGalt:

    I saw how you did that Willie

  • Error Doc, error. When the scriptures are studied in context it is easy to see how like you said, Gods name and scriptures are quoted out of context to justify a persons actions. It is a historical fact that the first American Bible was printed for use in public schools to teach Christian principles which was the reason for creating public schools in the first place. Our fore fathers believed that teaching society strong Christian principles was the key to a free and prosperous Nation. Allot of people may not like it but that's the way it was. To think the Judeo/Christian Laws that were used as a foundation for our Nations laws and public education can be as effective when opposed to the God of the Bible is irrational. That's all I'm saying. I'm not trying to convert anyone. And yes some of our founding fathers were agnostic/athiest but a majority of our forefathers were Christians. As a matter of fact George Washington was so adamant that his troops had Chaplains in the Army that he and his soldiers payed for the Chaplains salaries out of their own pockets because the Army couldn't afford to. Washington also said that failure to provide the troops with Chaplains was a grievous and repugnant injustice.

  • In reply to ImissButkus:

    It's also a historical fact that the King Jame's Bible is a work of absolute fiction. Count the number of translations from Aramaic, Greek, Latin - look at King Jame's. Think he didn't have things appear as he wanted them? In the first and original version of the Bible, Jesius was married with children. Conveniently left out don't you think? There is no rational, intelligent argument a human being can make that the King Jame's bible is anything other than what it is. A novel.

  • In reply to IrishBearsFan:

    Jame? Jesius?

  • In reply to ImissButkus:

    The supreme court changed their 'interpretation' of the Bible, namely the sixth commandment, so that they could feel better about executing people. Seeing as the word of God was getting in the way of their plans somewhat, the commandment 'Thou shalt not kill' was changed (in the fifties?) to 'Thou shalt not commit murder'. Talk about having stones. Correcting God!
    "What God *meant* to say was ..." (!?)

  • See what happens when a thread stays too long?

  • In reply to ImissButkus:

    I'm all for discussing outrageous scams pulled on the masses, beat's talking about Brian Cushing's blood tests, no?

  • In reply to IrishBearsFan:

    I can talk about anything.

  • In reply to ImissButkus:

    Kind of like that old saying about guests and fish after 3 days...?

  • I know Doc. I know. Not a fan of the Bush's. Never have been. Am a fan of the truth.

  • In reply to ImissButkus:

    Mythology was one of my favorite subjects in school.

  • In reply to Albertintucson:

    +1
    And a good read too, unlike "Jacob begat Ruth, and Ruth begat Springer, And Springer begat BeJaybus, BeJaybus begat Butkus, Butkus begat Chaos ..."

  • In reply to ImissButkus:

    Trac, don't EVEN get me started.

    Ok, now.... wait for is @ 1:57 and 2:10: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6rSW3yIP5SY&feature=player_embedded

    I like this kid.

  • In reply to ImissButkus:

    Dear Baby Jimminus - please start the season now. I love my fellow DBB commentators but if I have to think about money supply theory when I should be reading about Afalava's shoulder issues, I am going to lose it.
    Thanks, Jimminus...LYLTSOGIP

    MBHAP

  • In reply to ImissButkus:

    Funny, there doesn't seem to be any Bush fans left. I was one of the few people in the world who was agaisnt the Iraqi invasion, which is it what it was, let there be no misunderstanding. It was Germany and Poland in 1939, no different. Condoleez Rice can't be that stupid. She knew she was looking at eleven year-old French intelligence photos. She KNEW that and is therefore a fucking liar and should be executed for high treason. Why did Colin Powell resign?

  • +1
    Washington, Lincoln etc. had no time for ghosts n' Goblins and things that went 'bump' in the night. For the uniniatiated, people don't die for three days and then come back to life unless the doctor had flunked the calling time of death. I'm fairly sure virgins don't get pregnant either.

    I'm also pretty surprised Jimmy Carter appeared to be a believer. But Georgie Boy is dumb as a box of frogs.

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