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Cubs Rumor Thread 7/30: Geovany Soto has been traded to the Rangers

Cubs Rumor Thread 7/30: Geovany Soto has been traded to the Rangers

So you've probably read that the Cubs will almost certainly make a couple of deals by now, but the deadline is now fast approaching. As of this writing, there is less than 29 hours until the buzzer sounds...

9:44PM: Tim Brown of Yahoo and the Kapman both tweet and  that Soto has been traded to the Rangers

9:24 PM: Geovany Soto is now giving hugs to all this teammates.  Another Cubs player traded?

8:58 PM: Okay everyone, normally I don't think these kinds of things mean anything, but Reed Johnson was just pulled out last second out of an AB and immediately began shaking hands with teammates.  Stay tuned for a trade announcement.  The guess here is that it's more than just him.  As for some speculation, the Braves really need a RH hitting OF'er....

8:23 PM: Jon Morosi tweets that the Cubs and Dodgers are still talking scenarios which would send both Ryan Dempster and Alfonso Soriano to the Dodgers.  Ken Rosenthal broached the possibility this morning and the fact that those talks are still ongoing has to indicate at least some interest on the Dodgers part.

7:20 PM: Tom Loxas says that a source told him there's no chance that the San Francisco Giants are interested in Alfonso Soriano as was reported on twitter.

2:47 PM: Jim Bowden tweets that although the Cubs are trying to accommodate Dempster, they will not do so if they don't receive talent in return.  While George Ofman tweets that Garrett Gould may be part of the deal, suggesting that perhaps Zach Lee, Allen Webster, and Chris Reed may not be part of the deal.

1:23 PM: Jayson Stark writes that the Nationals have positioned themselves as a fallback for Ryan Dempster if the deal doesn't go through with the Dodgers (or Braves, for that matter).

1:05 PM: Jim Bowden once again chimes in, this time saying that if the Cubs go to the Braves with the same offer and  a signed document that the Ryan Dempster for Randall Delgado deal can still get done. It's hard to say whether this is Bowden's own speculation or if he knows something here ,but it's definitely something the Cubs should looking into with both Dempster and the Braves -- especially if the Dodgers don't budge on their original offer.

12:58 PM: Jim Bowden tweets that the Dodgers could instead get in the Cliff Lee sweepstakes by offering Zach Lee and Allen Webster.  Jon Heyman, meanwhile, says Dodgers are not in on Cliff Lee.  You gotta love rumor season ;)

12:12 PM: Ken Rosenthal tweets that Alfonso Soriano is still involved in the Ryan Dempster to Dodgers trade talks.  The Dodgers are still looking for a bat as well as a pitcher and there have been few hitters as productive as Soriano has been since mid-May.  Obviously the Cubs would have to eat a chunk of Soriano's contract, but it could be a way for the Cubs and Dodgers to compromise.  The Cubs aren't going to budge on the kind of talent they want back and the Dodgers have been reluctant to add much to their original offer.  Instead of either team backing down, maybe you add in a player that the Dodgers can retain for a couple more years.  It goes to show how far Soriano has come this year that teams are a) willing to deal with them and b) put him in the field.  It was assumed that he could only go to an AL team but the fact that the Dodgers are pursuing him shows how much Soriano has allayed fears about being a liability in LF.

10:20 AM:  Things are eerily quiet, but nothing new to report yet.  Just felt like I need to open this thread!  Pass along any rumors you hear in the comments section.  Josh Beckett is the latest pitcher on the market for teams that want to pick up a flyer on a pitcher having a bad year, has a bad contract, and by some accounts, has a bad attitude.  And that's not even mentioning his health issues of late.  There was also a rumor that Hunter Pence was about to be dealt to the Giants but that turned out to be false for now.

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  • I may have to take part in a self-imposed from all new Cubs until the deadline is over. It's all I can do to keep myself from refreshing this page every 10 minutes to see if anything has happened, or if anyone has posted something entertaining. I teach, so it's not exactly my busy time right now, but productivity is at a complete standstill.

  • In reply to TheSinisterUrge:

    I'm going to do that Tuesday all day until 6 pm. Who has to
    make the first move, Dempster or a GM to get a trade done.

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    In reply to emartinezjr:

    I might have to do that too. Every time I see a new tweet has popped up, I get a little excited, but it's just John thanking a retweeter :)

  • In reply to TheSinisterUrge:

    Geez...Let me re-type that first sentence CORRECTLY. This is the reason why fat fingers don't work well with texting/typing on phones. I mess up, autocorrect doesn't work, and I think faster than I can type. It should have read:

    I may have to take part in a self-imposed break from all Cubs news until the deadline is over.

    I teach, but obviously not English/Grammar. Yeesh.

  • In reply to TheSinisterUrge:

    Haha, you and me both. My wife has the day off today and she gets to witness the madness of the trade deadline. Needless to say, I'll have to make it up to her soon.

  • Got a rumor kind of second hand, but the guy usually knows what he is talking about. He says the biggest problem why Dempster really doesn't want to go to Atlanta, is he and Chipper Jones have a real dislike for each other. Some grudges that go way back. Who knows?
    I am pumped up today, as I am in Chicago for a wedding, and will be going to see the game tonight, section 105. First game I have been to in over a year. And I get to see the legendary Joe Germano toe the rubber. As long as Rizzo is in the lineup, it will be great.

  • Chipper said some glowing things about Dempster to the press the other day. I'll see if I can dig it up. Of course, people will say anything to the media, so who knows?

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    I dont know about you guys, but I like it when things are unusually quiet like this. Most trades happen this way and kind of sneak up on you. It shows the the GM's are doing less talking/blowing smoke and more dealing. This season has taught us that the trades you don't hear about are the ones that actually go down, rumor free. I wouldn't be surprised if most of our guys get dealt without us even knowing it was being discussed until after, like the Ichiro trade.

    Again I think this silence means things are happening

  • In reply to Marcel Jenkins:

    Like the Dempster to Atlanta trade.

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    If all went as planned that deal was supposed to go down just like the Ichiro one in that by the time anyone even heard it was happening the deal was 100% done, no trade provisions and everything already taken care of. The story broke about 24 hours premature and dempsters indecision didn't help which lead to a failed deal.

    I feel like if all was kept quiet none of those happens

  • That originally came out of nowhwere. And then it dragged on for a day and well, we all know what happened.

  • In reply to John Arguello:

    That was my point too, John. There were no rumors of a Dempster to Atlanta trade until it supposedly had been agreed to by both front offices. New/old rumor, the Dodgers and Braves are still in play for Dempster.

  • Not aware of a problem between Dempster and Chipper. I was at the last Braves game at Wrigley Field in May (a 1-0 Maholm gem), and the Cubs honored Chipper before the game. I sat right behind home plate, and as I recall, Dempster presented the gift -- a jersey -- and they laughed and looked like pals. It seemed genuine.

  • In reply to drben:

    I lean this way as well. I remember him talking about the respect he had for Dempster and in fact, I quoted it here.

  • How much do you think Demp's divorce is playing into his decisions? I was thinking about how he did say he would go to a list of teams. He has to give permission for the move, but so does the mother of his children. Maybe she said, "you move to Atlanta, we're staying here. Go to LA, we'll go with. I'm not living in Atlanta though." So much to speculate on our end since we really don't know what the exact story was. Demp gets the benefit of the doubt from me.

  • In reply to Break The Curse:

    The Sun-Times says Dempster said that had nothing to do with it and they're giving that "blindsided" type excuse for him. Obviously I hope he has a more legit reason than that.

  • In reply to Break The Curse:

    I thought she was going to Denver.

  • Dempster laughed becaiuse he rubbed poison ivy all over the inside of the jersey before handing it over.

  • In reply to eaton53:

    LOL..nicely played.

  • Hopefully things pick up on the news front, John. But if you are looking for thread ideas, I was recently wondering how the Cubs have done from the perspective of "areas of improvement". I seem to remember the main goals for the club were to:

    1) Defense: Improve defensively.
    2) Offense: Get on base more frequently/take more pitches.
    3) Pitching: Limit pitches & walks/get the ball in play more often.

    Maybe you can offer your assessment using advanced stats at some point -

  • In reply to Cubswin4harry:

    I can't wait to start writing about that kind of stuff again! I'll be glad when the deadline is over.

    Thanks for the suggestion. A look back is definitely a good idea. Probably not until all this is over, but soon after.

  • (Wakes up and writes) John, please do us all a favor and before this get way over 100 posts or so, start an overflow post so we can put large blocks of comments to sleep. The topic can always get resumed in the new one.

    It'll make it easier to deal with for you and everyone else.

  • In reply to SFToby:

    Sure, I can do that...

  • LA certainly isn't where I would have guessed Fonzi would go, but I guess if they put up with Manny in LF (and the throwing arm of J. Pierre) then Soriano might actually be an upgrade to what they've had in recent years. Maybe they're looking forward to putting him at DH during the WS!

  • In reply to cowboy2024:

    Good point. They have taken on those kinds of offense first players in the past. Maybe there's some hope here.

  • I cannot believe I'm typing this. I was the biggest supporter of getting rid of phonsy. But honestly, he's showed me something this year. And his salary right now is a sunk cost...Cubs can afford it especially with the payroll figures at this point being so low over the next two years. And given the fact our minor league outfielders might not be ready for a few years (unless we trade for some). I think I'm talking myself into keeping him around. Yes, he still swings and misses at some bad balls and more times than not, fails in the clutch...but his defense has improved and he seems to be a better hitter. More revived overall. Of course as I'm typing this, I wouldn't mind Dempster, Soriano and cash for Webster and Reed :)

  • In reply to apalifer:

    You're not the only one. I've heard others say that as well. He's been productive and even fun to watch this year. But I have to say that if he helps bring back future pieces, you have to do it. He's simply not a part of the long term plans. I think he'd be a great pickup for the Dodgers.

  • Via MLBTR:

    "1:09pm: The Nationals have positioned themselves as the perfect fallback option for the Cubs on Dempster, reports ESPN's Jayson Stark.  It's unknown whether Dempster would approve a trade to the Nats."

    Seems a bit vague. Heard anything about ths John or Tom? Curious as to how the Nats have "positioned themselves."

    Hope Bowden is right about the Braves, though it would be surprising.

    John, are no teams concerned about Cliff Lee's backloaded contract? I hope the asking prices for Lee, Shields, and Johnson are/remain super high so that Cubs pitchers look more attractive.

  • In reply to cubbie steve:

    Haha...just posted ;) Good timing. I read the original Jayson Stark column. The wording is curious. I don't know if it means a fallback deal is in place or if it's simply a way of saying that the Nationals strategy of waiting in the weeds and ready to pounce.

    Teams are plenty concerned about Lee's contract. It's not going to be as easy to move him as people might think.

  • In reply to John Arguello:

    Will his contract affect the return? It seems that "industry experts" just assume Texas will trade for him AND gladly give up Olt.

    Obviously, it wouldn't be a Hanley situation, but it seems to be a tough sell to ask teams for a huge haul and take on a huge contract.

    25 more hours of anxious feels, page re-loading, twitter feed reading, speculation, and hopeful dreams!

  • I think all these writers are pulling these rumors out of their arses. he are just speculating. I dont expect Cubs to make any major moves if they havent by ths point. Unortunately I think we are stuck with what weh ave and maybe later Jonson, Lahair Baker etc might go in a waiver deal and tht will be about it Dempster backtacking on his word and Garzas injury lond of derailed the Cubs ability to make a move. Bummr.

  • In reply to Behn Wilson:

    A lot of it too is execs purposely leaking info that benefits them too. These story breakers have great relationships with the media and there's some give and take. But yeah, some of it is speculation, some of it is real rumor, and some of it is smoke.

    Things have really not gone the Cubs way this trade season. It's been frustrating to say the least. Can only imagine how Theo and Jed feel.

  • In reply to John Arguello:

    I honestly think these most of guys are just speculating at this point, they probably get half their rumors off message boards like this.

  • And count me among those would hate to see Soriano go now too. A year ago, never thought Id say this. I doubt we would get a quality enough prospect and would stillhave to pay the majority of his salary so why just give him away. Hes been a good influence on Castro. The skeptic in me wonders the way he has bounced back, kind of like Big Papi in Boston, when it appeared both were done, Im kind of wondering if they waent back to the HGH since they still are not testing for it.

  • In reply to Behn Wilson:

    I doubt Sori is. He isn't the biggest of guys and hasn't had any big changes over his career. That being said, he is the only 40/40 club not known for juicing.

  • In reply to Break The Curse:

    If you dont think Soriano juiced, Ive got some land deals to sell you

  • In reply to Behn Wilson:

    I will offer up a comment a friend of mine on our college footbll team told me. Steroids make you unbelievably stronger.. He was an offensive lineman. He said even if you didnt want to do them, you had to because you couldnt compete against those that were dong them. A similar concept applies to baseball players too, the more that were doing them, a lot f players were kind of forced to just to keep up.

  • In reply to Behn Wilson:

    Sounds like you know something as an insider. If so, bring it out. Otherwise you are just spouting unjustified rumor and spreading slander.

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    In reply to StillMissKennyHubbs:

    If you read the Sports Illustrated article a month or so back that was about a former Twins/Yankees reliever who used steroids and HGH and gained 10 mph on his fastball over 3 years.

    http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2012/magazine/05/29/baseball.steroids/index.html

    I read another article in the last few months that one former player said probably at least 20 players on every team were juicing (late 90's/early 2000's teams). I wish I remembered where that was to link to it.

    The more I read about all of this I've just started to assume every single player during the late 90's/early 2000's were juicing. So wondering if 1 or 2 Cubs were cheating is kind of foolish, it seems that there were tons of Cubs cheating, same as every team. I'm sure plenty of guys are still using HGH today since it's not tested, but we don't see people showing up to spring training looking like godzilla like Bonds and Sosa did in one offseason.

  • In reply to Behn Wilson:

    Land deals, eh? Breaking news in sports and politics is no longer surprising. I just don't speculate on HGH things until printed.

  • In reply to Break The Curse:

    I guess this board isnt the proper place for that type of speculation. But if you think a player on your team is taking performance enhancers like HGH which will be tested for in the next year or two, it would be time to trade them before their performance dips substantially.

  • In reply to Behn Wilson:

    I'm in agreement with you on Big Papi and Soriano. They're taking something. I thought HGH testing was coming next year or the year after. The game will be more about speed and youth again.

  • In reply to Greg Shuey:

    So you know something too? Or just jumping on the rumor-mongering slander wagon?

  • In reply to StillMissKennyHubbs:

    I dont have any inside info on Papi (but he has been linked to PED use in the reports) or Soriano, just speculating, sorry if I implied otherwise. I have a little info on steroid use in genera, lived witha few users of it but this board seems to have a lot of overly sensitive people on this issue so I wont post on this topic anymore.

  • In reply to Behn Wilson:

    Nah, this board is the perfect platform. Just back it up like Just Win with an article or two. I think the sensitivity comes from Sori being one of the few positives on the big league club and we want to keep him on the happy shelf. I've enjoyed your comments since you began posting.

  • In reply to Behn Wilson:

    Just put your money where your mouth is.
    In other words, show your hand or else don't spread innuendo. It serves no purpose.

  • In reply to StillMissKennyHubbs:

    I have not seen Soriano take anything. Big Papi got busted for it. My sources..I played with guys in college who used steroids and HGH. I played with guys who played for multiple MLB teams. I have heard a lot from them and every bit of information they gave me has turned true.

    Now, just doing average deductions with some of these guys, I think it's easy to pick up on it. Sorry if I offended you.

    Do you ever wonder how A-Rod looks like he does, just came off hip surgery but his lower body looks like he's ready for a body building show?

    Anyway, I think it's on the decline in MLB. You can tell by the home runs that are in decline. The one drug that can be used unless you just took it within 24 hours is HGH.

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    In reply to Greg Shuey:

    The problem with HGH testing is the best test they have right now only shows if it's been in a person's system in the last 24 hours. So unless you basically catch a player a few hours after taking it, they'll pass the test. They need a more accurate test before we're probably going to see a huge decline in HGH use in pro sports.

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    Folks, I hope I'm about to eat a bunch of crow here. Dempster has been my favorite Cubs for a long time, and I'm among those who've given him hell on this board in the past week. I still don't like the wishy washy way he dealt with the ATL:trade, but I'm not convince that if the Dodgers keep low-balling the Cubs, he won't be true to all the things he said in those June interviews regarding how he wanted what was best for the team as well as himself.

    Anyways, there is a strong indication that the parameters of last weeks failed deal had been on the table for over a week when it broke, and several different analysts think the Braves broke the deal on purpose as a way to put pressure on Dempster to accept it, only to have it backfire.

    Second, there are good indications that there is more at work on Dempster than most people are aware of. We all know about his sick child, but there may be something else going on in his personal life that is serving as a source of grief. Rumors abound that his preferred trade destination may have more to do with his wife, possibly soon to be ex, and where she will or won't move to in order that he get as much access to his kids as possible. Who knows if all that is really true, but it's plausible, and it would explain much?

    Again, I don't know if the second part is actually true, but it is getting some serious discussion on other boards. As someone who has been through the "BIG D", and I don't mean Dallas, once, I can sympathize with what he "might" be going through.

    As for the first part, I think it's very plausible. We know the Cubs had been in discussions with the Braves for a couple of weeks prior, and we know the leak came from Atlanta.

    Overall, I think it's important to remember that Dempster is still one of the good guys, though he might be a little tarnished right now. He has given us Cubs fan some great moments of the years, and in more recent years, he has been the anti-Zambrano. So I think the man needs to be cut some slack.

  • In reply to Michael Caldwell:

    It's all the media, in my opinion. They spin things one way, then come back with another. The truth is we'll probably never know exactly what went down. It is strange that Soriano is now beloved and Dempster became a villian. I guess the weather isn't the only thing in this town that changes every five minutes.

  • In reply to Michael Caldwell:

    I think there's a lot of mixed opinion on Dempster. The only thing I can say is that I'm frustrated as a Cubs fan, but I just don't know enough to make any other judgments on the matter. Maybe time will tell, maybe not.

  • In reply to John Arguello:

    The problem with Dempster is he put Atlanta on his approved trade list and if he had not done that noone would have had a problem with him. These personal issues with him are not new and he had them when he gave the Cubs his approved list.

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    In reply to Behn Wilson:

    Who called it an "approved trade list"? I thought it was a list of "preferred destinations". There is a big difference, and how exactly do you know what issues in the man's marriage are new or not? Really? I hope you guys that have been attacking him personally, calling him a liar and greedy and everything else I've read, are man (or woman) enough to admit you rushed to judgement if and when the truth does come out. (like Michael Caldwell, way to man up)

  • In reply to Matt McNear:

    I think it's perfectly okay to state our opinions, because they are reactions. Michael's opinion seems to have changed somewhat as more news comes out. Demp did say that it was frustrating that ppl jumped all over him when they didn't have allthe facts. I just want this thing to end well. For the record, I'm okay for people to be upset over how things played out. However, the fact that this whole thing leaked out without the player's approval is what makes me most mad. If this hadn't ever leaked, LA has no leverage and the deal potentially still goes through. Dempster was put in a precarious situation. The reality is the way things went down sucked for The Braves, Cubs and Dempster. The only beneficiary is the Dodgers, but it doesn't appear the Cubs will cave to their demands.

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    In reply to Michael Caldwell:

    I didn't know anything about Dempster's divorce situation until a few mins ago reading this thread's comments. I understand his motives more, even if it's only for 2 months, you don't want to leave your kids half way across the country, especially during a tough time like the early stages of a divorce when the kids are confused, scared, etc.

  • In reply to Just Win:

    You also shouldn't put your kids in that situation by cheating on your wife.

  • Ken Rosenthal ‏@Ken_Rosenthal
    Source: #Cubs "trying to bend over backwards" to get Dempster to #Dodgers, his desired team. Talks continue.

    Remember when the Cubs were going to trade him for quality prospects and then re-sign him in the offseason? That was a fun dream...

  • In reply to North Side Irish:

    I just read that as well and don't believe it. If the Cubs wanted to trade Dempster to L. A. so desperately, they could just do it for a PTBNL.

  • In reply to North Side Irish:

    Hopefully by "bend over backwards" they are eating every single dollar possible and throwing in spare parts (Jeff Baker or Reed) to increase the prospect haul.

  • In reply to cowboy2024:

    I'm picturing it as the Cubs keep making different trade proposals involving multiple pieces and the Dodgers are holding firm on their original offer. Basically the Cubs are trying to get something done and the Dodgers aren't playing nice so far.

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    Non-Thread Related News: Boise's Ian Dickson was just announced as the NWL Pitcher of the Week.

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    Allen Webster had been pulled as Chattanooga's starter tonight. Does that mean anything? Who knows?

  • In reply to Michael Caldwell:

    could just be that LA wants to make some deal with some team....and Webster would probably be in almost any Dodgers deal. just a guess

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    In reply to cubbie steve:

    MLBTR and others keep reporting Victorino to the Dodgers is heating up.

  • Kevin Goldstein ‏@Kevin_Goldstein
    Heard that Zach Lee, Allen Webster and Chris Reed are all off the table in any Dempster talks.

    Thanks for the leverage Ryan...

  • In reply to North Side Irish:

    Saw that too. This is not looking good.

  • In reply to North Side Irish:

    Cubs still have all the leverage. They have an asset that other teams want. They do not have to trade Dempster. Teams that are interested have to make an offer the Cubs want.

  • Cubs have absolutely zero leverage. Dempster is using his 10-and-5 rights to create a market of one, which means the Cubs can really only get offers from the Dodgers. And the Dodgers only want him at their price. Any offers from other interested teams are meaningless if Dempster sticks to his demands.

    The only shred of leverage the Cubs have is to tell Dempster they will keep him and move him to the bullpen if he doesn't accept a deal. Which hurts their reputation with future free agents and probably gets the MLBPA involved.

  • In reply to North Side Irish:

    For the sake of debate, let's pretend the Cubs don't trade Dempster and they make him the qualifying offer and he accepts. Would that be such a bad thing? Next season the Cubs might have 5 starters younger than Dempster and they might have 5 starters who make less money, but I doubt they'll have a rotation where all 5 starters put up better numbers than Dempster would in an average season. They certainly can afford his next season's salary. Why trade him for prospects they don't really want, just to trade him?

  • Agreed. I'd rather keep him than take a useless deal like the one we got for Fukudome, or Lilly.

  • In reply to John Arguello:

    I totally agree with you, having Dempster back next year might not be that bad if we can not get a decent return for him. No way Id acccept a Lilly type deal if I were the Cubs. It could be worse than goinginto the season with a top 4 of Dempster, Garza, Shark and Maholm. Fukudome was worthless so no return was expeted for him, his trade was to clear playing time for Colvin, gee that worked out great didnt it.

  • The problem isn't that the Cubs need pitching for next year, they need someone that will be pitching for the next 5-10 years. If Dempster can't get the Cubs any value, then it doesn't help them long-term.

    That, coupled with the Atlanta trade fiasco. probably means that Dempster will get dealt. I don't see things working out between Dempster and the FO that would allow him to stay on. I would think the relationship is strained, at best.

  • In reply to TheSinisterUrge:

    Both sides are professional. I doubt that the Cubs will trade Dempster just because of a possible "strained" relationship. How about we wait less than 24 hours and see what happens?

  • Cub fans are forgiving. If Dempster comes clean and offers up some apologies it will be okay for him. He was welll enough liked that he can probably overcome this if he says the right things.

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    No, that isn't a terrible thing. In fact, if the deal were friendly enough to the Cubs, I think they'd give him an extension. We all know that Dempster has intanglibles that simply can't be measured, and you can bet this front office recognizes them. Like Charlie Leibrandt with the Braves, Dempster would be a fine stable pony who is still an effective starter. They can still trade Garza for pitching prospects this winter.

  • In reply to Michael Caldwell:

    Well put!

  • In reply to North Side Irish:

    I think you under-value the leverage the Cubs have as sellers. Sure, they are handcuffed to Dempster's ultimate decision, but the Dodgers don't have leverage over the Cubs, especially with the Braves, and now at least the Nats wanting Demp.

    And Demp, if he stays, will face a very angry home fanbase, and come off as a man who doesn't care about winning. I've said it once and I'll say it again, if Demp cares so much about his family and doesn't care about going to the playoffs or winning the WS, he should just retire.

    There are only a couple scenarios where Demp comes out looking good: 1) Dodgers finally pony up and pay...and pay well or 2) The Braves still offer Delgado and Dempster approves. Anything else and Demp's image is hurt.

    I can respect him for choosing family first, but choosing family first means retiring. And if he won't retire or play for a winner, what would that say about his priorities?

    As far as future FAs....if you pay them, they will come.

  • Am starting to hear that the cubs have caved in. Hope this is wrong. Don't do it cubs!!!

  • T minus 24 hours and counting.

  • The Dempster hate-fest is back in full gear on Twitter. Don't hate the playa, hate the game.

    I've never been a fan of the 10-5 rule. If I had a vote I'd make it so the player could officially veto ONE trade (either per season or over the course of the deal). I wonder what the players association would say if a veteran re-signed with a team and waived his 10-5 rights in lieu of an extra million or a player option at the end of the deal that automatically kicks in if traded?

  • The Marlins are now telling teams that Johnson is off the market unless something "very unforeseen" happens. If that's true, Dempster and Garza just became a little more valuable.

  • Phil Rogers ‏@ChiTribRogers
    Just listened to Ryan Dempster. Sounds like he will accept trades to several teams. #readingtealeaves

    And Phil Rogers is ALWAYS right, so we're all set now. Feeling good...

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    In reply to North Side Irish:

    I read Phil tweeted the Earth is flat...

  • In reply to Just Win:

    lol. I think the actual tweet was My sources report that the earth is flat.

  • From mlbtraderumors.com:

    2:41pm: Dodgers pitching prospects Zach Lee, Allen Webster, and Chris Reed are all off the table in Dempster talks, tweets Kevin Goldstein of Baseball Prospectus.

    1:41pm: Talks between the Dodgers and Cubs for Dempster are gaining momentum, reports Scott Miller of CBS Sports. The Cubs are trying to bend over backwards to get Dempster to the Dodgers, tweets Ken Rosenthal of FOX Sports.

  • In reply to giamby:

    3:41pm: Cubs have asked for Dodgers bullpen catcher in Dempster negotiations but LA has made it clear that he's not available.

    4:41pm: Dodgers have taken baseballs and bubble gum off the table in Dempster talks

  • My dark horse team for Demp is the A's they have three top 100 pitchers in Peacock, Gray and Cole (61,70 and 72 respectively). It puts him closer to his buddy Lilly and on a team competing for the Wild Card (currently owning it). My initial thought is that the A's usually collect prospects, not dump them. Still, they are in position to make a play for a postseason run so why not? The short answer is that their starting rotation is pretty good. Outside Colon though, it might behoove them to have another veteran to spell some of their younger arms and really make a push.

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    The following is not actually a rumor. It was a discussion I heard on 1530 ESPNR out of Cincinnati. Mo Egger and Lance McAllister were on. Mo also does Reds pre-game on the radio. It's no secret the Reds would like a leadoff hitter and another #3 or better starter. The names Dempster and DeJesus came up. Apparently, the Rays are wanting more for Shields than what Milwaukee got for Grienke, and the Phillies seem to be asking quite a bit for both Juan Pierre and Shane Victorino. Neither seemed to think Jocketty would match the asking price. Both agreed Dempster and DeJesus would fit a need, and that, even with the Latos and Marshall trades, the Reds still have the prospects to get it done without damaging their system. They mentioned an interesting name: Robert Stephension, the Reds 2011 1st round pick (27th overall).

    Stephenson made his MWL debut Friday night. In 5 inning, he gave up no earned runs, 1 hit, walked 2 and struck out 6. The most interesting thing was his velo. In the first inning, he was low to mid 90's. By the third inning, he was mid to upper 90's. In the fifth, he was hitting triple digits. It's hard to see the Reds parting with such a promising young arm, but if the Reds and Cubs talk, I'd bet his name gets brought up.

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    In reply to Michael Caldwell:

    I'm surprised the Phillies haven't moved Juan Pierre yet. Unless the trade market is far worse than what everyone thinks, which might be true. If you look at most of the trades in the last week they've all been mostly better players, other than the Brewers and DBacks trading guys they DFA'd. Maybe the market for the Reed Johnson's and Juan Pierre's of the world just isn't there, which is odd, they shouldn't cost much in a trade and can help push a team over the top.

  • Maybe we old cubs fans are seeing the cubbie occurrences like Garza's cramp and Dempster's reluctance as the boogie men here when actually the whole trade market has changed. With the emphasis on prospects now, maybe no one wants to give them away because they can't be replaced as easily in the future. May make some GM's pause before pulling the trigger.

  • In reply to cubster:

    I was going to make a similar comment, but thought I might be crazy. Glad to see somebody else is thinking the same way! I was going to come from a slightly different angle, though.

    With another playoff spot available now, maybe it is enough for some clubs to be competitive (it keeps fans happier, therefore higher attendance, more cash, etc.) and not risk giving up prospects that could ultimately put them over the top.

    It might just be a combination of the two factors that *might* lead to a change in philosophies near the trade deadline.

  • Tell me again why we don't

    1) KEEP Garza, Dempster, and Maholm (Along with Shark)
    2) Sign FA Greinke as our #1
    3) Sign a less erratic FA closer
    4) Go for it in 2013

    Thanks and have a good one!

  • In reply to DropThePuck:

    We have too many holes in our lineup to be competetive next year, though our starting pitching is pretty good 1-4 currently. We only have 3 legitimate offensive bats in Soriano, Castro, & Rizzo. The rest of the lineups is a bunch of backup qualty (if even that) as starters other tan Barney who is a great fielder but only has a so so bat.

  • In reply to Behn Wilson:

    Darwin "Boom Bomm" Barney takes offense at your post, and has 4 RBI tonight (so far).

  • In reply to TheSinisterUrge:

    No kidding. I thought Cub fans were over hyping a so so rooki last year, but he has really grown on me and I am glad they didnt trade him. If they fill out the lineup Barney with some hitters then Barney is a nice piece to have with his stellar defense, you dont have to have 8 blasters in there. He will look a lot more valuable once we soldify the rest of our lineup..

  • Add :
    1b) Call up 3B Vitters and C Wilkins NOW, stick 'em in the lineup for a couple hundred ABs, let them get over the adjustment pains THIS year, and give them a healthy does of ML coaching NOW

  • In reply to DropThePuck:

    I curious to see what Vitters can do. If he continues to improve this year, hopefully he will get the September callup. Id probably rather see Castillo then Soto behind the plate too. Be nice if we could see hm moved and open up the slot.

  • 5:45 Dempster's toothpaste rejects the deal so it is rescinded. .

  • Removed a negative comment directed at another commenter. We don't do that here. Keep it about baseball.

  • And thanks for keeping the rumors flowing here. I'm keeping an eye on them, but everything is so vague and speculative that I'm waiting until we hear something big.

  • In reply to John Arguello:

    John,

    Please tell me that your sources, and Tom's as well, are as confident of significant moves (i.e. "not minor", as you hinted) to be coming soon as they were when you posted your rumor piece yesterday. They haven't backed off on their statements have they?

  • In reply to supercapo:

    Haven't heard from my source one way or the other since then. Said he would let me know if anything changes, so I'm assuming that as of now they're still confident.

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    Saw this on another website and I nearly wet my pants from laughing!

    “The Decision” to be Presented Live on ESPN Thursday at 9 p.m. ET
    Ryan Dempster to Make Formal Announcement as to Where He’ll Play Next

    One of the most anticipated decisions in the sports world – where MLB superstar pitcher ryan Dempster will play this season and beyond – will be officially revealed on “The Decision,” to be presented live on ESPN and ESPN Radio Monday, July 30, at 9 p.m. ET.

    Proceeds from “The Decision” will be donated to Boys & Girls Club of America in support of Dempster’s vision to construct baseball fields for youth across the country. The program will be co-presented by University of Phoenix and Bing. vitaminwater® and McDonald’s will also sponsor the program. In addition, Nike and Sprite are making contributions in support of this charitable initiative. Ryan Dempster and his marketing company, RDMR Marketing, were responsible for securing the sponsors for this unique event.

    ESPN’s Stuart Scott will host “The Decision,” and will be joined by ESPN MLB analysts Steve Philips and Pedro Gomez. Freelance reporter Jim Gray will conduct the first interview with Dempster in which he announces his decision. Philips will also have an extensive interview with Dempster.

    ESPN’s 6 p.m. ET SportsCenter will expand to three hours leading into the hour-long “The Decision” at 9 p.m. Following “The Decision,” ESPN will televise an expanded SportsCenter from 10 p.m.-midnight (9 p.m. PT). SportsCenter’s coverage throughout the evening will provide news and information associated with the decision, an overview of the MLB free agency landscape, and a recap of the other sports news of the day. ESPN will also have reporters at the team headquarters of several teams which have been most active in free agency.

  • In reply to bocabobby:

    Haha! Nice find.

  • Tomorrow at 5 pm when I next follow this mess I hope Dempster
    is finally gone.

  • In reply to emartinezjr:

    I keep telling myself the same thing but I can't help keeping my eye on it!

  • In reply to John Arguello:

    I think all of us who work at a computer, our work efficiency will go up about 500% after this stupid trade deadline is over with.

  • Love Reed. Gonna miss home. Hope it involves one of our big pieces.

  • Johnson pulled from game in 5th inning, getting all sorts of handshakes in the dugout. Hmm...pinch-hit for because of large deficit in score, or something else?

  • Reed Johnson just got pulled from the game and was shaking hands with Cubs players. Pretty sure deal will be announced soon.

  • In reply to John Arguello:

    Let's hope it involves Demp as well!

  • In reply to John Arguello:

    I thought Whhite Sox could use hm, they have no outfield depth, he be perfect as their 4th outfielder.

  • In reply to Behn Wilson:

    I hope the front office thinks more of Reed than to send him to a half empty stadium playing for the "other" Chicago team....

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    In reply to John Arguello:

    I hope he goes to the Yankees, they need OF help and it would be nice to see Reed with a strong shot at winning the WS.

  • In reply to Just Win:

    Hard not to root for him. Great guy and a nice player off your bench.

  • In reply to John Arguello:

    I'm hoping he's a piece of a multi player trade. I don't believe he would net much of a prospect on his own.

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    In reply to Larry H:

    Probably not, but if the FO can grab an A ball arm with potential upside for a bench guy who will be a free agent, that's a smart move. But maybe's he's a sweetener in a Dempster deal or Garza.

    Anyone see Dempster or Garza in the dugout?

  • In reply to Larry H:

    I hope so too.

  • John, is there any realistic chance that Demp ends up a Dodger w/o LA parting with any of Lee, Webster, Gould or Reed? It seems that just a week ago we were talking about LA not having enough to get Garza, and how Lee would have to be the centerpiece of a Demp deal....then a couple days later, were conditioned into finding a Lee-less, Webster deal as acceptable....and now it appears that the Dodgers "caving" would "merely" net a "Gould" or "Reed," and if we can even get that, we should be happy. No thanks!

    And if Delgado really is still on the table, this should be a no-brainer. Dempster should be thinking long and hard about ATL or nothing at this point. I have to give it to Theo & Jed, because if it were me, I'd be letting LA area code calls go straight to voicemail.

  • In reply to cubbie steve:

    I think Webster would have always been a nice deal for the Cubs. Not as nice as Delgado, but good value, imo. I never really thought they had a chance at Lee with Dempster alone.

    We'll see.

  • The Cubs removed Reed Johnson from today's game and it appears that the outfielder has been traded, Bruce Levine of ESPNChicago.com reports (on Twitter). Four teams made offers for Johnson today, including the Pirates and Tigers, according to Levine.

    I'm hoping the other 2 teams are also looking for starting pitching and that Reed is in a deal with them.

  • In reply to Larry H:

    I'm sure it doesn't matter to Reed, as I am sure he will do his job as a professional ballplayer, but how much would it suck to be traded mid game from a team winning 13-2 to the team losing their game 13-2? I hope he doesn't go the Pirates, as I don't think they really have a legitimate shot to win, but also because they are the enemy right now.

  • Good news for everyone if Soto has been moved. He is really struggling here, and could use a change of scenery. It's time to see what Castillo can do.

  • In reply to TheSinisterUrge:

    That would be great if Soto was traded. Lets start the Wellington Castillo era.

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    Bruce Levine tweeted 4 teams made their best offer for Reed today, including Pitt and Detroit. So maybe he's not in a package.

  • In reply to Just Win:

    Maybe not. It wouldn't be as exciting if it was just Johnson because he won't net much.

  • In reply to John Arguello:

    I can't see the point in trading him straight up for a prospect since the return would be of minimal value. I'm praying he's in a deal with Demp to ATL....

  • If a guy is traded mid game to te opponent an has already played, can he play again for the other team?

    Would sure be crazy if RJ shows up in the other dugout in 10 minutes!

  • In reply to Steve4cash:

    I'm pretty sure that he has to be on the roster to begin the game, but that would be strange, wouldn't it? It would be strange enough for him to be in their dugout tomorrow.

    I think any team would want to have a meeting beforehand to tell them the news, then to introduce him. Any team that gets Reed Johnson likely means that someone else is either being shipped to Chicago or being sent down to the minors. You wouldn't want Reed showing up and making that more awkward.

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    In reply to Steve4cash:

    No he can't re-enter the game for the other team. But there have been guys traded in between games of a doubleheader and appeared in game 2 for the other team.

    And Joel Youngblood was in a game at Wrigley as a Met, traded, flew to Philly and appeared in the game that night for the Expos. 2 games in 2 different cities in one day.

  • The dugout is going to be empty, by the end of the game it will only be Shark, Castro, Barney, and Rizzo and they will be tuckered out from excessive hugging.

  • I started this thread stating I was going to take time away from Cubs news. Now I'm sitting at my laptop reading Cubs Den, watching players hug their teammates as they are seemingly on their way out of town, with ESPN and MLB Trade Rumors site also on the laptop. Geez. C'mon, trade deadline, you're killing me!

  • Was Geo just hugging his teammates? Is he the next one out the door?

  • Hilarious....

    "SamMillerBP: Wife just hugged my baby. Gonna miss that kid."

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    Bob Nightengale just tweeted:

    BNightengale: Still awaiting news where #Cubs Reed Johnson is going. The #Tigers have shown interest, and pitch prospect Thomas Collier pulled after 3 IP

  • fb_avatar

    Wow, now it looks like Geo has been traded.

  • Okay. Now Geo Soto is getting hugs from his teammates.

  • Now Soto? Maybe garza, soto, and Reed to tigers?

  • fb_avatar

    thekapman: Not sure it is related at all but the Iowa Cubs pulled Brett Jackson after an 0-3 night. He is hitting .253

  • In reply to Just Win:

    Wsthere any hugging involved?

  • Watching the dugout is more fun than watching the game!

  • In reply to Steve4cash:

    Yes it is and it's past my bedtime......

  • If Brett Jackson does come up, wouldn't you believe it's to be a starter and not a 4th outfielder?

  • Bob Nightengale tweeted:

    "Still awaiting news where #Cubs Reed Johnson is going. The #Tigers have shown interest, and pitch prospect Thomas Collier pulled after 3 IP."

  • In reply to cubbie steve:

    Doug Padilla tweets that Brett Jackson likely called up to Cubs.

  • In reply to cubbie steve:

    I wonder if this means anything for the rest of our outfield. IMO, you don't call him up Jackson to sit him on the bench. We've still got LaHair, DeJesus, and Soriano in front of him.

  • In reply to cubbie steve:

    I think he might have need a little more Triple A seasoning, but Im looking forward to seeing him if that true.

  • In reply to cubbie steve:

    I would have figured Sappelt would be the Reed replacement.

  • In reply to cubbie steve:

    Collier a TJ survivor, real good breaking ball.

  • In reply to John Arguello:

    He looks to have pretty decent numbers this year. Any idea on what he projects to be and how far off he is, assuming he is coming to the organization?

  • Ken Rosenthal ‏@Ken_Rosenthal
    Told #Cubs have made separate deals with Soto and Johnson.

    Was hoping Reed was the sweetener on a bigger deal...still maybe.

  • Gosh, I just hugged my grandson good night and he started crying.
    "Does that mean you're trading me?" he said.

  • In reply to StillMissKennyHubbs:

    Lol, that was good

  • Rosenthal says Nats, Rays, and Rangers among teams looking for Catchers

  • In reply to cubbie steve:

    Also says it wasn't the tiger who traded for Johnson, and it wasn't the mets who traded for Soto.

  • In reply to cubbie steve:

    edit: this second tweet was Heyman, not Rosenthal.

  • So long, Geo.

  • In reply to Eddie:

    It's kind of sad that it ended this way. He had a hell of a start with the Cubs, and probably still has something in the tank. Hopefully this is a deal that gets him refreshed, and helps the Cubs out, too, both with a prospect and getting some playing time for Castillo.

  • Finally the logjam broke for the Cubs , maybe not the Dempster trade but something. Dempster will be traded , either to the Braves or Dodgers, the Cubs seem to be hoping to throw Soriano in so the Dodgers will throw in a Webster or Reed.

  • John,

    What can you tell us about Jacob Brigham?

  • In reply to supercapo:

    Looks like a fringe prospect, 24 yr old RHSP with so-so numbers in AA. I'm sure John will have a full report in short order but if that is all they got, it shows how much the Soto stock has fallen. It's a shame after his rookie and 2010 campaigns but at least we'll get to see Castillo.

  • If true than it's Dempster to the Dodgers or nothing.

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    Just announced on the broadcast. Johnson and Maholm to Atlanta. Geo to Texas. No word on who's coming back.

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    In reply to Kevin Heckman:

    These aren't confirmed yet. But apparently "very reliable sources."

  • Moholm and Johnson to Atlanta

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    By Paul Sullivan, Tribune reporter

    10:01 p.m. CDT, July 30, 2012

    Reed Johnson and Geovany Soto left Monday's game against Pittsburgh to hugs and handshakes in the dugout after being dealt during the game.

    Soto went to Texas for Double-A pitcher Jacob Brigham, according to cbssports.com. Johnson and left-hander Paul Maholm were reportedly packaged in a deal to Atlanta, according to the Atlanta Journal-Constitution.

  • Wow and things go nuts

    There is a rumor on twitter(saw it on the BCB feed) that Brett Jackson is in the reed Johnson deal and also a ton of people saying that he was called up to the cubs, gonna be interesting to see which is true

    One would assume if he was called up to the cubs he would play everyday and that would mean soriano or lahair are gone

    Either way, crazy stuff

  • i have a feeling that one of the propects comeing back in the paul and reed deal is spurill or graham

  • In reply to dakota cubs fan:

    I wouldn't be surprised if it's Delgado.

  • In reply to dakota cubs fan:

    I've seen Braves bloggers saying Spruill was NOT included...ATL has tons of pitching prospects, but it doesn't sound like the Cubs got any of the top ones.

  • In reply to North Side Irish:

    Mark Bowman, who we all know so well from the Dempster disaster:

    Mark Bowman ‏@mlbbowman
    Still working on who the Braves used to acquire Maholm and Johnson. It's not Delgado, Spruill, Teheran or Minor.

    Mark Bowman ‏@mlbbowman
    That last name was supposed to be Gilmartin. But Minor is also not involved.

  • In reply to North Side Irish:

    Jerry Crasnick ‏@jcrasnick
    Pitcher Jaye Chapman is one of the players going from #Braves to #Cubs in Maholm-Johnson deal, source says.

    Jerry Crasnick ‏@jcrasnick
    Chapman, 25, is 3-6 with a 3.52 ERA for AAA Gwinnett. He has 60 strikeouts in 53 2/3 innings.

    Meh.

  • fb_avatar

    Rumors are that Jacob Brigham is coming back to the Cubs from the Rangers for Soto.

  • In reply to Michael Caldwell:

    Looks like Bringham is a power arm for the pen or maybe #3 or 4 starter if his change pans out though this from a scouting report from two years ago...

    http://www.bbtia.com/home/2010/5/12/highest-ceilings-in-the-rangers-system-jake-brigham-14.html

  • Toronto writer says that the Jays are interested in Matt Garza. Jayson Stark then says one exec said "very high chance" Garza is traded. And that the Jays have been looking hard at him.

  • JIM BOWDEN ‏@JimBowdenESPNxm
    Alfonso Soriano has told Cubs he will not go to Giants in trade

    Might have broken Twitter if he had...

  • And now Rosenthal says that the Reds are in talks with the Cubs over Garza.

    This.is.awesome.

  • Ken Rosenthal ‏@Ken_Rosenthal
    Source: Vizcaino and Chapman to #Cubs for Maholm and Johnson.

    Wow.

  • I would have loved Vizcaino last year. I am wary of a TJ guy. Hopefully he is a closer for this team.

    As for the Reds, I hope they swing a deal. I have watched their AA team the Pensacola Wahoos, managed by Jim Riggleman. I can only wish, but a deal that would include one or more of Billy Hamilton, Daniel Corcino, Didi Gregorious, or Tony Cingrano for Garza would make me more excited after the ATL trade. Other guys at AA that looked good were 2B Henry Rodriguez, JC Sulbaran, and Donnie Joseph, though he is a tad older than I would want as a big part of any deal.

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