More Cubs compensation talk: Red Sox unhappy, Padres next

According to Jon Heyman, Red Sox owner John Henry did not sound thrilled about receiving Chris Carpenter as compensation for allowing Theo Epstein to walk one year early on his contract.

Per WEEI in Boston, Henry said there was a "fundamental misunderstanding" with the Cubs on Theo compensation.  That has been obvious from the start.  That misunderstanding stems from this: Henry and Larry Lucchino have clung to the word "significant" as if it had some iron-clad, universal meaning.  And that meaning to them was a top player or prospect that would completely blow away any sort of historical precedent.

Both teams made an error in my opinion.  Cubs owner Tom Ricketts made a mistake when he met with Epstein and came to an agreement with him before deciding compensation.  The Cubs should have decided something beforehand, but their eagerness to land Epstein caused them to jump the gun.  They gained a reprieve when Commissioner Bud Selig let Epstein go to the Cubs before compensation was decided, effectively taking away the tremendous leverage the Red Sox built by letting the Cubs agree to terms first.

The Red Sox mistake was letting the Cubs talk to Theo in the first place.  The time to haggle over compensation was before allowing them to talk because there would have been little Selig could do.  The Red Sox were under no obligation to give permission and they could have denied it until they got the player they wanted.  Theoretically, anyway.  Perhaps if the price were too high, Ricketts would have turned to Hoyer to GM and then waited on Theo.

In the end, Lucchino had this to say about the final compensation,

"All's well that ends.  Period.  That's our view on this thing.  Let's move on.  Next issue."

For once, I agree.

For the Cubs he next  issue is the compensation for Jed Hoyer/Jason McLeod.  Reports are that the Padres have a list of 12 low level minor leaguers to choose from and they are not expected to the system's top prospects.  It's also not expected to be someone from the 40 man roster.  The issue should be resolved soon and certainly before the end of spring training.

I managed to get lucky on my Chris Carpenter prediction a while back.  This time I'm going with Class A LHP Austin Kirk.  Kirk was Fangraphs 9th rated prospect and has the kind of peripherals the Padres seem to like.  He has the potential to have command of at least 3 average pitches, which would make him a solid back of the rotation starter.  He could be a nice fit at Petco.


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  • What?, Red Sucks er Sox are unhappy?, dang am I feeling your pain John and Larry?, no, not even a little bit. It no doubt could have and probably should have been handled a bit better than it all went down, but....I'd really hate to be the next team owner, GM or whoever that goes looking to hire any management types out of Boston for awhile.

  • In reply to daddyo:

    True...if anything it's another incentive to leave that organization when you can.

  • John: I hope this is one case where your prediction is off. While Kirk's stats from 2011 don't jump out, it sounds as though he may have hit a wall after a solid start. He pitched a total of 64 innings in 2010; and had 75 in already at the mid point last year(with a 4-3 record and a 2.39 ERA) before things unraveled. I'm also pretty sure this guy threw a no hitter last summer. With starting pitching prospects already thin(let alone a potential lefty starter), I'd love to see him join Cates in the Daytona rotation and see if he can take the next step. Also, where does Hayden Simpson stand in the organization-any hope of getting on track?

  • In reply to Upstate NY Cubs Fan:

    I think you're right abou Kirk pitching a no-no last year. I wouldn't put in on any list that exposes him.

  • In reply to Upstate NY Cubs Fan:

    I hope I'm wrong and the Cubs give them someone with a little less promise. I do think the Cubs have a lot of lefty pitchers in that 89-91 mph range: Kirk, Rusin, Del Valle, Raley, Jokisch, and, of course, Concepcion, though he's still young enough to throw a bit harder in time.

    I'm waiting to hear reports on Simpson's velocity. He lost about 10 mph on it last year. Will write something when I hear about it.

  • In reply to Upstate NY Cubs Fan:

    Upstate NY, SF guys are right. Kirk did throw a no-hitter last year. In fact, he had a dominant 1st half in general.

  • John -
    How about a post that asks readers for ideas that might help the Cubs financially? I'll start it off:
    Since the city of Chicago won't allow a jumbotron to be installed at Wrigley because of its historical landmark status and also because it might block some rooftops, how about the team buying a building and installing on on its rooftop. The building itself could serve as its office suites and then the Cubs would then have room for a bigger clubhouse, indoor batting cages, etc. The revenue stream would pay for the building quickly as well as remain a viable money stream for years to come.

    I photoshopped what I thought is might look like and put it on my twitter:

  • In reply to SFToby:

    I don't consider myself a money/business/marketing guy. I'd definitely have to ask you guys for ideas!

  • In reply to SFToby:

    I just can't see the city allowing a jumbotron on a building. I'm sure it wouldn't be possible with zoning laws alone? I will ask around on it though.

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    In reply to Tom Loxas:

    Uhmm, why wouldn't the city be ok with a rooftop jumbo tron? They seem ok with the multiple advert boards up there already and the rooftop decks that exceed the zoning laws of those properties. Put a screen where the Torco/Southwest/Miller Lite sign is, it hardly would affect the look of the neighborhood at all.

  • Something happened to that photo

    Here's one that should work:

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    Hey John, you said TR made mistakes in the Sox deal, but we won. We got what we wanted and didn't give up a "significant" player. Maybe he didn't mess up, maybe he played it perfectly. TR has proven to be a savvy businessman already...I'm giving him credit for the win.

  • In reply to mblum876:

    I think the Cubs came out the winner in that Boston really wanted to use Epstein to get a great player and did not, but I'll bet if you ask Ricketts he'd do it differently. If Selig didn't step in and give him Theo, he'd have been screwed. They had a hard enough time trying to come to an agreement with Theo in the fold already, if he was still under contract with Boston, they could have really held him hostage.

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    There were other qualified candidates. He could have stolen Friedman or Beane possibly. Its not so much as the person, but the method in which they evaluate the players. I think TR just wanted the new school GM to run the cubs.

  • In reply to mblum876:

    Possibly. I think there are a lot of qualified GMs or GMs to be out there. I'm a fan of Coppolella as the next up and comer. I guess we'll never know for sure how much TR liked Theo over the other guys.

  • Oh hell. Do the right thing and give Boston Soriano...

  • Anything new on Jorge Soler?

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    Nothing new on Soler. As of earlier this week he was still waiting to be approved to be able to negotiate a new contract. Some office of whatever that I've never heard of has to approve foreign players. Office of Foreign Assets or something like that. It would be nice for him if he can sign before spring training gets too far along, no matter what team he ends up with.

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