Listless Bulls drop game to Hornets

The Chicago Bulls proved that they can lose to crap teams at home with or without Derrick Rose by falling to the Charlotte Hornets.

The Bulls didn't come out lifeless and deflated. They just finished that way.

They actually jumped out to a fairly big first quarter lead until the Hornets reigned them in to tie the game at 20 a piece. The teams battled back and forth, but went into half time tied at 44.

In the second half, and particularly in the 4th quarter, the Bulls simply dropped the rope. In the end, Al Jefferson was able to find repeated success in the post while the Bulls struggled to get much going.

By the time Jimmy Butler hit a pair of consecutive baskets, the lead had grown too much, and Chicago still couldn't stop the Bobcats.

The Bulls need to find their groove without Rose

Unlike the past couple seasons, they have little time to do it right now, and it doesn't look like there's a waiver saver like D.J. Augustin set to come in and help.

Chicago didn't shoot the ball horribly at 44%, but their 18% from the three point line was pretty awful (and the result of a poor shooting night). While the Bulls weren't bad with turnovers or offensive rebounding, the Hornets were better with both.

The razor thin margin without Derrick Rose taking up attention and playing meaningful minutes is back. In the end, the Bulls bench was awful. With Aaron Brooks starting and Kirk Hinrich playing bench PG minutes, the Bulls had very little pop off the bench.

I like that Brooks got the start as he's clearly the better player, but Chicago needs more shot creation on the floor if Hinrich is going to be out there. At this point, it's time to see what Doug McDermott or E'tuan Moore can do, because Hinrich isn't bringing anything to the table.

Joakim back as a playmaker

Noah finished with eight assists against one turnover, and we got to see some of his strengths on display. At the same time, it's worth remembering the Bulls were last in offense with Noah leading it last season.

It's good that he get some looks, keeps the ball moving, and provides another way for the Bulls to attack, but Chicago can't count on Noah to produce quality offense for the team.

I do like his greater involvement though and in some ways the ball movement looked better against Charlotte than in recent games. Unfortunately, even with good ball movement, Chicago couldn't buy a bucket, particularly a long range one.

Hopefully, we'll see a better effort Friday.

Derrick's tear theoretically minimal

The general consensus is that Rose's tear isn't that bad. It's a smaller tear and at this point he'll do the trim procedure instead of the reattachment [which may not be a viable choice even if he wanted to do it].

In that instance, he's looking at a recovery time between 3-8 weeks. There's no timetable set until after surgery. Eight weeks puts him as recovering during the first round of the playoffs, three weeks has him recovering considerably before then.

Looking at his history, as I noted yesterday, you should take the expected longest recovery time and add about 25-30% of the total recovery time to it and that's when we can expect Derrick back. That's how long it took on the ACL and first meniscus tear.

Maybe some of that was mental. Maybe he's in a different place now. Who knows. My guess though is that unless Rose is back at the early end of the time table (say one month) and gets a good five to ten regular season games under his belt that even if he will return for the playoffs he'll be so out of sync it won't help.

Really, the Bulls weren't even in sync enough this season after 50+ games, so the idea that Rose will miss a month then be back to 100% and have time to get the whole team in sync is somewhat of a pipe dream. Rose has shown a history of also playing very poorly initially when returning from injury, so my hopes are pretty low.

Sorry for raining on your parade.

I'm sure if we get to the point where he actually is coming back, some hope will be reborn, but at this point it has to be viewed as pretty faint.

Bulls considering Nate Robinson

Realgm reports that the Bulls are having exploratory talks with Nate Robinson.

Robinson has a strong desire to come back to Chicago where he had probably his greatest season. Bulls fans certainly have a strong love for Robinson as well.

Personally, as much as I loved Nate when he was here, I'm probably passing on him. He does know the system. He does know the players. Unfortunately, he hasn't played well since tearing his ACL, and I'd guess he's simply lost a step.

For a guy who's 5'9 to no longer have elite quickness means it's game over. He's been absolutely awful this season, and some of that may be circumstantial, but it's by far the worst season of his career. Combine that with the ACL, and I figure the odds aren't so great of things going well here.

I'd simply rather not tarnish my Nate Robinson memory at this point. I'd wager that E'Twuan Moore is going to give the Bulls more than Nate right now, so I'd stick in that direction and sign someone else to be the new 14th/15th guy in case current guys go down.

I'm still pulling for Toney Douglas personally. That said, I wouldn't hate the move if we did get Nate, but I just wouldn't have much in terms of expectations.

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  • I did not see the game, but it sounds like they just missed shots - no help from deep.

    Not a lot of TOs. Noah was involved. All pretty good.

    I would suspect that they struggle in the 4th without Rose, who has been at his best late in games.

    Look, Rose has not been all that great this year. He's been solid, but there have been many off nights. Aaron Brooks can come close to 18 and 5, or whatever. Brooks provides way better shooting. The biggest thing the Bulls miss is the late game closer.

    But, is Rose that guy? I'm sorry, but he's just not what he was. Our hope was that he was just taking it easy and had another gear for the playoffs.

  • This team can remain together for next year and have one more shot. There is no reason to blow it up, unless you talk about trading Noah with one year left on his contract this summer. That could be a move to provide an additional draft pick knowing that there are three solid front line players still, so it does not hurt next year's team all that much - maybe in spirit, which I may be underestimating here because he bring a lot of heart.

    I think the emergence of Snell, and we saw this with Butler in year two, shows that there is still hope for McDermott next year and beyond.

    Karl should make an impact in Sactown. They have won 2 of 3, including a convincing win last night over Memphis. They still have nine games against Philly, Lakers, Utah and NY. They have the 7 seed right now, but they are about 3 losses out of the 12 slot and there will be tanking going on throughout the NBA in March and April. Sactown is not tanking or else they would have just hired Karl in the offseason.

    Bulls could have picks 11 and 20. Maybe they throw in both picks and Noah, or maybe Snell, and try to move up.

  • In reply to Granby:

    Thanks for the Sacramento - George Karl update. Beating Memphis is certainly unexpected. Maybe there is still hope?

  • In reply to Granby:

    To end the season in the mix for the 11th draft position Sacramento will need to be around .400. They are currently .364. Before George Karl's 3 games they were .346.

    W-L over the remaining 27 games:
    12-15 = .390 ending
    13-14 = .402 ending
    14-13 = .414 ending

    So Sacramento needs to play around .500 under George Karl for Bulls to get Sac's draft pick. Though if I were George Karl I'd want that draft pick in the off-season.

    As Bulls fans, this and Dr. Brian Cole are what we have to root for.

  • D.Rose goes down and Thibs still doesn't play McD? Seriously?

  • In reply to Sluggers:

    At this point I think it's clear McD doesn't belong on the court based on practice. We've seen how bad he can look. We've heard it reported from his own teammates that he cant play D in practice. His confidence was so low in the beginning of the year it's prolly the right move to keep him off of it this year. Let him learn and work on his game now that he knows how much improvement he needs to make. Better luck next year for him.

  • In reply to CN71:

    I think that we need to give McDermott a chance and wait another year before judging. I thought Butler was terrible until the middle of year 2 when got a legit shot at consistent PT. Even then, he didn't show much until late in the season and playoffs.

    We all hurried Snell on this website until about 3 weeks ago. He looks like he could be a nice player in this league at this point.

    McDermott also got hurt and could have been hurt in the preseason and early regular season when he did get some PT. This Bulls team is deep and talented with other shooters now. If he was healthy, maybe he would have gotten more time when Dunleavy was out.

    I think he does have a shot to be a nice player still. Outside of Mirotic who has more professional experience, no rookie has done anything as a rookie for Thibs.

  • In reply to Sluggers:

    Based on the development of Snell and Butler and the fact that McDermott's own teammates say he isn't ready I would give Thibs the benefit of the doubt. He has been surprisingly effective in developing young players. McDermott might be a great shooter but so was Jimmer Freddette and the dude couldn't make it in the league because he couldn't defend anyone. Doug has better size so is more likely candidate to develop into a passable defender. Thibs is giving Niko burn and he is a rookie. I think it is clearly more a issue with Doug McDermott than Thibs hating on rookies.

    I am disappointed though as McDermott was advertised as one of the most NBA ready prospects. If we were going to get nothing from our prospect all year I would have rather seen them take the lotto ticket on Zach LaVine. He has legit star upside with his supreme athletic ability at SG. The McDermott pick was propped up on the fact that he could produce right away and that has been proven blatantly false. To soon to right him off but why take a guy with a low ceiling if you are going to sit him all year and wait for him to develop into an NBA player? Why not go for a high ceiling prospect...

    Thibs is the man if he can get Sleepy to look like a quality NBA guy and Jimmy Butler can be transformed into a near all star after coming out as a one dimensional low ceiling player then I am not doubting Thibs developmental abilities. Imagine what this guy would do with a couple seasons with a Zach LaVine type athlete.

  • In reply to Chad:

    Spot on regarding the McDoug pick and I think you're right about Thibs too.

  • In reply to Chad:

    Excellent analysis of the McDNP situation. The thing that is so frustrating about it is that if his athletic limitations are so obvious that even his teammates are commenting that he can't guard anyone even in practice how the hell did the Bulls scouting people not know that going into the draft. Like you I wanted the Bulls to go with a superior athlete like LaVine or Payton, or a more well developed player like Saric who could have followed the Mirotic path.

    I'd say that prior to the draft McDNP was the one guy that all Bulls fans feared the Bulls would take precisely for this reason, they would fall in love with his numbers and ignore everything else, even if it was screaming at them.

  • In reply to BigWay:

    For what it's worth, fellow NBA rookies voted McDermott the second most likely to succeed behind Jabari Parker, so plenty of people who know the game though McDoug was the real deal.

  • In reply to Roman F:

    Hey, the Bulls have tried to draft before based on the athletic potential, Tyrus T for example, and how did that work out?

    There has to be more than meets the eye with McDermott. Hopefully he will work thru it.

  • In reply to rustyw:

    Obviously drafting on athletic potential is much riskier. If the risk was the same then all the best athletes would be drafted at the top of the draft... My point was we have a great talent developer in Thibs at the very least getting a high level athlete should translate into a solid defender in his system. Best case scenario we may get a potential superstar. Management has shown the ability to shed guys early enough to still get a return on players that they feel aren't development material ala Tyrus and JJ. So I think the risk is worth the reward considering we aren't getting anything from McDermott this season and I think we do eventually but still he is considered a low ceiling high floor guy. Although getting smoked in practice on the regular doesn't give me that much confidence in his floor.

  • In reply to Roman F:

    "Fellow NBA rookies"? No offense, but if I were looking for a group of people associated with the NBA to advise me on anything basketball, "NBA rookies" would be right near the very bottom of the list.

  • In reply to Don Ellis:

    On any other topic including the NBA, I'd agree with you, but they're his peers. In any line of work, people's peers generally have a good idea of who among them is the best.

  • In reply to Roman F:

    http://www.nba.com/news/features/john_schuhmann/2014-15-nba-rookie-survey/

    Mirotic didn't get a single vote in any category.

    That should tell you how much this survey means.

    Those guys also voted Stauskas as #2 shooter, behind McDermott. The Stauskas who plays for Sacramento, shooting .326 overall, .261 from behind the arc, with a .393 TS%.

  • In reply to Don Ellis:

    Well I wrote "for what it's worth," and it's apparently not worth much to you, which I totally get. There were a lot of independent NBA experts who thought McDoug was a good pick. There are a lot of players who have been very successful despite some obvious flaws, others are never able to overcome them. We'll see which one McDoug ends up being.

  • In reply to Don Ellis:

    For what it's worth, I completely agree with what you're saying that many, many folks - from fans to media "experts" - thought Doug would step right in and be "NBA ready".

    If McDoug takes the Tony Snell development route, I'll be happy.

    I still drool at the thought of a Rose/Gasol pick and roll with Snell, McDermott and Mirotic at the 3-point line. Hell, you could put Gasol in the corner and let Derrick go one-on-one with 4 outstanding shooters all around the arc, and there's no way the defense can help on Rose.

  • In reply to Sluggers:

    Obviously, you meant McDNP(CD).

  • If Rose is available for the playoffs, even if he plays like crap, that's still an improvement from where he's been the last three post-seasons. I agree with Doug that whatever happens with Rose, his impact will likely be minimal. Hopefully Rose can come back in the 3-4 week time frame, and get a handful of games under his belt.

    The good news is that Captain Clankaroo is not in the starting lineup. That bad news is that he's still on the roster. Removing AB from the bench unit certainly had a negative impact, as that group loses a viable scoring option. Moore should be given a shot at backup PG, because really, he couldn't possibly be worse than the alternative.

  • In reply to BullsMan:

    Yes, and Bulls have E'Twaun Moore under contract for next season. Though unguaranteed, he is a bargain at $1 million salary.

  • Rose coming back this year will boost the team's morale regardless whether he plays like crap or not. So, I still think if he can come back, he should come back regardless. But, even before Rose's injury, I don't think this team could win the EFC, so to me nothing has changed other than my expectations for this team this year, which now looks more like going to the EFC finals as the stretch goal.

  • Last night Garnett game back to the Target Center and the TWolves demolished the Wiz behind an onslaught from Kevin Martin. Wiz look like crap since Beal went down.

    Garnett is no longer a scorer but it is truly remarkable what he adds to the team. He sets terrific (multiple) screens, still plays top-notch defense, and rebounds. His emotional leadership is off the charts. I thought the TWolves were nuts trading Young for him but I was wrong. He is now the unquestioned leader of a very young team. Still plays with great energy for short periods of time. Bulls will have their hands full. Expect Rubio to chew-up Brooks and Trainwreck.

  • In reply to hgarbell:

    Maybe we need to find a way to get Doug's boy, Kevin Martin.

  • In reply to BigWay:

    Is there a way now? Anybody got any tapes of Silver saying something really stupid?

  • Nikola Mirotic played 11 minutes and change last night. Granted you could alibi that, and say "well he only had 1 rebound yada, yada." Bottom line: you either feel seeing what you have with Mirotic and developing him NOW is more of a priority then trying to eek out wins with "vets." Or you don't. And McDermott I mean let him play a block of minutes and see what he looks, but giving him no chance? Only captive of the moment Tom Thibodeau. That's what will sum up his head coaching "career" with the Bulls, a captive or prisoner of the moment. Pathetic.

    When I see guys like Brooks and Mirotic who won certain games for the Bulls as much as anybody did earlier this season with their play, and then were discarded like trash in subsequent games. I mean is that not supposed to effect your mindset when they have injuries and suddenly decide OK now I'll play you since all is lost? Still, if they get consistent minutes on a nightly basis(which will not happen they will vary greatly from game to game thanks to Thibsy), but then yes they have to perform at some point.

    Finally, Dunleavy and Hinrich as 34 year olds who in 40 Minutes combined give you 2 rebounds??!! Not to mention 4 assists between them.. with 4 nullifying turnovers. As long as Klank Brokedick and Dunleavyalone(with these guys to rebound or defend them) occupy significant court minutes, I am not watching this garbage. Not unless Mirotic starts playing at MINIMUM 25-27 minutes a night. Other wise wake me when it's over i.e the season and Tom Thibodeau has been fired.

  • In reply to RoadWarrior:

    It is clear that when all 3 big men are healthy, Thibs will only use Mirotic as the backup 3. With Snell getting more minutes and some if not the majority of them coming at SF, 8-12 minutes is about all that we can expect Niko to get, unless Dunleavy goes out again.

  • Side note: March Madness just around the corner. For those who don't like college ball as in "playoffs" or wanna hear about the draft please disregard. So many guys take years to bear fruit it's true, and the McDermott Pac-Man gobbling of two No.1's we'll see how that one turns out.

    Those interested: the more I see of Tyus Jones PG out of Duke, the more I like him. Shooting 39% on somewhat decent volume of three 3-PT shots per game(nearly 90% from the line which is huge). Sporting a nearly 3 to 1 assist to turnover ratio. McDonald's All-American. He's 6'1, but with a 6'5 wingspan. This guy might be available at 18 or 19(depending on what Duke/he does in the tournament) if the Bulls rise a few spots. Yes he's not a great athlete as in leaper, but he does have an exceptional handle and exceptional quickness according to NBADraft.net and from what I've seen of him. Gets into the lane with ease, but needs to develop mid range/around the basket game i.e pull up jumper and floater as his two point percentage needs to improve from .445. Still Jerian Grant is the better prospect. As is arguably Delon Wright 6'5 nearly 3 to 1 on volume assists. Definitely an outstanding year for PG's. Grant would be the guy to contribute soonest almost certainly. And again Joseph Young is going to be a steal in the second round though he might take time to adjust to NBA and needs to add some meat on his bones. But he's got the drive and character you look for.

  • That game sucked, it was just depressing to even watch. I can't stand this garbage about McD not being able to defend anyone in practice, who cares. We also heard that Derrick was dominating matchups and by far and away the best player on the court in practice when he was on the fence about coming back a year or two ago and that was obviously bogus.

    When they packaged two picks, and one being the mythical TT pick from Charlotte, to move up and grab McD there was absolutely no way he was considered to be a developmental player this year. Everything that was written about the pick suggested that they saw him as ready to contribute immediately, with his shooting range alone being a reason that he could be on the court. Maybe the injury really set him back, I don't know. I do know that Dunleavy isn't setting the world on fire, and I just can't see how your worse off if McD actually sees the floor a bit. Whatever, Bulls sucked on D all year and Thibs will still use that as an excuse not to play McD. At this point they should at least see what he looks like in game action. Really, what are we clinging to?

  • Exactly who in the front office claimed that McDermott would be a quality contributor right away? Forman, or Paxson, or Thibs?

    I haven't found even one quote by any of them that even remotely indicates any of them thought he was going to come in and be a starter right away.

    Lots of media said it, and lots of fans said it, but can anyone show me ANY quotes by the coaching staff or front office saying it?

    This seems to have turned into yet another mythical reason to trash the front office, without any basis in fact.

    I can't find any - I can, however, find quotes where Thibs plainly says it's pretty rare for any rookie to have much of an impact on a championship contender. Easily.

    Maybe I'm wrong?

  • In reply to Don Ellis:

    If you didn't feel he could be a contributor right away then he seems unlikely to be a guy who'd develop much.

    His skillset is immensely refined already, and he has played in college for four years. He's not likely to grow a whole lot in understanding of the game or skills.

  • In reply to DougThonus:

    Wasn't McDermott selected to practice with the USA team before the FIBA tournament? I seem to recall that it was reported that McDermott was holding his own against some of the best players in the league. I think even Thibs made a positive remark about his play at the time.

    If all this is true, isn't it somewhat strange that now it's rumored that he can't stay in front of anybody? Surely he guarded terrific players in these practices. I'm not sure how to reconcile all this.

    If I am wrong about these recollections then I guess I owe you guys an apology for wasting your time reading this when you could have used this extra 30 seconds to watch more internet porn at your desks.

  • In reply to DougThonus:

    Offensively I agree with you but defensively, he has a lot of development in front of him.

  • In reply to DougThonus:

    Couldn't the same thing have been said about Butler and Snell and Taj? Yeah they only played 3 years of college ball, but they are all worlds better than they were as rookies.

    All but the elite, HOF level rookies have to adjust to the speed of the NBA game, and to the fact that they are playing against men instead of boys.

    Let's just look at the original McDermott, Kyle Korver. As bad as he has looked this season, Doug has a higher TS% and eFG% than Korver had as a rookie, as Korver was playing for a 33-win team, not a championship contender.

    Maybe you're right and McDermott turns out to be a bust, but everything I'm reading about him was said last year about Snell (only worse).

    One year ago today, the overwhelming majority of Bulls fans were pissed because the Bulls took Snell instead of Hardaway Jr. I'm pretty sure we've heard the last of that one, wouldn't you say?

    Hell, it's only been 3 years since the majority of Bulls fans were pissed because we didn't take MarShon Brooks instead of Butler. Of course, those folks magically don't exist now, just like Brooks' NBA career no longer exists.

  • In reply to Don Ellis:

    The biggest difference with Butler was that we could see that he could play NBA defense even as a rookie. We just didn't know what if anything he could do offensively. Some of us were ready to move on from Deng just from the glimpses that we saw of Butler as a rookie, certainly after his sophomore campaign.

    Also, I think that Brooks went around 25, two picks after Niko, so we couldn't really have taken him instead of Butler, but apparently we could have taken him instead of Niko, which as it turns out would have sucked. That was clearly one of the FO good draft years, and as of this moment still the last demonstrably good year(Snell's 4 decent games not withstanding).

  • In reply to BigWay:

    Also, I think it was Georgiu Dieng that the majority of Bulls fans wanted instead of Snell(or even Plumlee). Both of those would still be valid calls, but there certainly were some calls for Hardaway Jr.

    I just don't watch the Knicks, but is it really obvious that you would prefer Snell to Hardaway right now, Hardaway has looked pretty good the few times that we've seen him.

  • In reply to BigWay:

    Some of us also saw glimpses in Snell last season, enough that we're not surprised that he's breaking out now that he's getting consistent minutes.

    Brooks is just a very good example of why you shouldn't judge a player's future based on what he does during his rookie season playing for a horrible team. He was 2nd Team All-Rookie, but now just three seasons later he's out of the league.

    Same thing with Dieng, he was 2nd-Team All-Rookie with a really bad team, and he hasn't really shown any improvement this season. Almost each and every one of his numbers are either the same or down from last season, we'll see where he's at in another two seasons when his rookie contract expires.

    Hardaway had a nice rookie year (for a bad team), but this season he's shooting 38.6% overall with a .507 TS%. Snell's numbers are better across the board, for the entire season not just the last 5 games.

    James Johnson was fairly putrid in his season and a half with the Bulls, now in his 5th and 6th seasons he's had back-to-back career years. He is certainly outperforming his draft position now, I think that is obvious.

    We can even go back to DeJuan Blair, who lots of Bulls fans wanted instead of Taj. Blair put up better numbers as a rookie, but he hasn't matched his production from that season in any of the next 5 seasons. Taj, meanwhile, has gone on to be one of the top 6th-man players in the league (this year's sucky play notwithstanding).

    I just think you have to give a draft 4-5 years to really judge it accurately. IMHO, it's just waaaaaaay to early to write off McDoug, and/or to think that he is "not likely to grow a whole lot in understanding of the game or skills."

    Time will tell.

  • Well, at least Thibs started Brooks. We got that going for us, for now.
    It will be interesting to see how Brooks responds as the starting PG.

    I think that we all felt that DJ Augustin was better in the emergency starting PG role and that Brooks was more like Nate in the bench spark plug scorer role. Hard to tell after just one night, but that's kind of what it looked like. Brooks did seem to look for Gasol quite a bit at free throw line extended/top of the key area, where he is most effective.

    Gasol had a surprise 25 & 13, but it really didn't feel like he impacted the game, nobody really did. Again, some quirky plus/minus numbers, Gasol minus 4, Noah plus 4 and Taj minus 24. Considering that 2 out of 3 of them were on the court together at all times the math wouldn't seem to add up. Although Taj must have spent a lot of his time with Snell and the corpsedog at minus 16 & minus 14 respectively.

    Really other than the first 6 minutes a completely lifeless uninteresting game, sad, boring, depressing?

  • This OUT for Thibodeau about how even McD's own teammates said he can't guard anyone in practice? First of all that was real nice to offer that tid-bit of destructive criticism to the public/media as in not keep it in house. Whoever outs a rookie teammate like that??

    I certainly saw lapses and at times entire court time was sub par defense from MCD, but I've seen far worse and there were definitely some spurts where I thought he did a decent job. There's now way I'm buying this as an excuse as to why he can't see at least 8-10 minutes a night. The problem is that rather then seeing what we have for team building and possible trading in the near future i.e this summer etc. you NEED to give the guy a chance. Period.

    Only if your higher priority is playoff seeding and ensuring as many victories as possible(Thibs and possibly the F.O.) which at this point it's hard to see the Bulls collapsing to the point that they don't make the playoffs. And Reinsdorf will get his playoff money so why can't we give a possible and maybe important asset at least a CHANCE?? It makes no sense not to play him unless you think he's so bad that you want to try and pawn him off on somebody in a draft night trade sight unseen so to speak.

    To be clear, Doug McDermott was NOT one of my top draft choices, but then again my two top picks in James Young and Cleanthony Early are doing squat this year as is the case with the majority of rookies. His(McDermott's) nearly 0.0 in steals and blocks is really simply unheard of for any successful college resume or any resume period for that matter. But once we drafted McBucketlist, I mean it makes no sense not to give the guy a chance and it gives fans a chance to see him no less. But then again fuck the fans as that's basically the Bull's front office mantra anyway as in trading deadlines are shunned like an unwanted relative who shows up drunk at your house on Thanksgiving. OK, admittedly yes I did, but that's only happened twice.

  • This sums it up:

    Chicago Bulls Rumors @chicagobullsbot
    Follow
    Chicago Bulls Doug McDermott is shooting 42%. Kyle Korver shot 35% his rookie season. Defensive minded coach Larry Brown still played him.
    11:02 PM - 7 Feb 2015

  • In reply to Don Ellis:

    I've been asking for video tape of Korver as a rookie all season. I am not worried about McDNPs shooting, his stroke is beautiful, nearly perfect. I wanted to know if Korver looked as spastic and unsure of himself on defense. McDNP at least so far doesn't look like he has the physical/athletic ability to guard anyone at any position in the NBA. Is that something that can be overcome? He also looks to be a little smaller than Korver(or Wally Z) so he probably has to be a SG which requires even more athleticism.

    I have no doubt that he can shoot in the NBA, can he defend enough to stay on the floor long enough to make his shooting valuable.

  • In reply to BigWay:

    and unfortunately for McDNP his career will always be measured against the career of Nurkic, the kid that Denver got with the first of the 2 picks that we traded to move up to get McDNP. It only took one exhibition game against the Bulls for me to regret missing out on Nurkic. Denver dumped Mosgov and McGee to clear the path for Nurkic to play this season. Only time will tell, but McDNP better be at least as good as Korver or Wally Z, as Nurkic will be much better than that.

  • In reply to BigWay:

    Nurkic has certainly looked outstanding at times by the eye test, and for the most part his numbers back that up. Of course just like Mirotic, Nurkic isn't your average rookie as he spent the last two seasons playing professionally in Europe.

    He's putting up 14/13 with 2.5 blocks (all per 36) on the season, but again he's doing it for a crap team, which cheapens the numbers.

    I certainly wouldn't count out Nurkic making an All-Star game like Korver and Wally Z did, but I have to admit that his Hinrich-esque .449 TS% in his 22 starts might be a huge red flag.

    He's got mad skills on offense, and seemingly good timing when it comes to blocking shots (plus he's been an outstanding defensive rebounder so far). The only thing I question is whether or not he's going to have the quickness to give much help defense.

  • I'm also looking for anyplace where Bulls' PLAYERS say that McDermott's defense sucks in practice.

    Can't find that anywhere, just like nobody seems to be able to find even one quote where the Bulls expected him to be NBA ready as a rookie.

    More myths? Please prove me wrong.

  • One of the beat reporters (i think it was Cowley) said it on the score one morning, I heard it as well. I still like McDermott a lot and think he will be a very good NBA player. Rookies don't play much on good teams. It doesn't necessarily stunt their growth. Look at Butler and Snell. Thibs is serious about player development. Korver is an interesting example. He said playing for Thibs improved his defense immensely and he is a much better player for it. Basketball players are made in the summer. Doug and Thibs will put in the hours this summer and he will get his minutes next year, and be a better player for having suffered through 2014/15 on the bench.

  • In reply to piggy7:

    Thanks for that, I certainly wasn't doubting anyone's word who heard it, I just know how many times I've seen myths turn into "facts" on the internet.

    Agree with everything else you said, and I'll add that with Gasol out tonight, I'd love to see McDermott get the SF minutes that Mirotic has been getting behind Dunleavy, just to see where he's at now that his knee is healthy.

  • In reply to Don Ellis:

    There is a small chance that McDNP could actually play since Mirotic will play PF tonight with Gasoline out. However, thibs doesn't need to play him(McDNP) as Snell can play all the backup minutes for Dunleavy and the corpsedog can cover for the 2-4 minutes that Butler is likely to get off.

  • In reply to piggy7:

    Next year will be key, can he come back after the summer and at least look like he belongs on the same floor(defensively) with NBA players. Right now he doesn't.

  • In reply to piggy7:

    "We all know Doug can play, he's been killing it in practice". - Jimmy Butler being quoted by Kyle Korver

    http://www.csnchicago.com/video_content_type/kyle-korvers-advice-bulls-doug-mcdermott (Right around the 1:00 mark)

    I about lost it last night when Brooks and Hinrich were on the floor together (with Snell at SF). They combined to shoot 4/21 from the field, 2/11 from behind the arc, and Jimmy had to play 43 minutes.

    Meanwhile, Brooks/Kirk played 6 minutes at SG in the 2nd half - WTF?? You can't tell me McDermott couldn't have played those 6 minutes in the 2nd half and maybe hit a shot or two. Or that he couldn't have played 5 minutes to keep Jimmy at 38.

    At the very least, Moore should have gotten a few more minutes once it became very apparent that neither Brooks nor Hinrich could throw the ball in the ocean last night.

    And instead of going small, why didn't Bairstow get 5-6 minutes?

    I've had enough of Thibs' complete lack of flexibility when it comes to rotations and playing time. This is his 5th year as a head coach (after 20 as an assistant), it's become blatantly obvious that he's never going to stop playing his preferred veterans, no matter how much they may suck on a given night.

    And it sure doesn't look like he's ever going to stop playing guys 15 or more consecutive minutes instead of giving them a 2-minute blow in the middle to help them play with more energy when they ARE on the floor.

  • In reply to Don Ellis:

    Yea, not a fan of the Brooks/corpsedog backcourt especially with Snell at SF and then Dunleavy at PF.

    I realize that after Taj went out somebody else was going to have to give us a few minutes at PF, but if thats the case, then you have to go with Jimmy at SF and Snell at SG so that you are not undersized at every position. Last night sure seemed like it was screaming for at least a couple of runs for McDNP. I really would love to see what's going on in practice with him.

    Under no circumstances is there ever any reason that Brooks and the corpsedog should be on the floor at the same time, unless its an exhibition game against the Globetrotters.

  • In reply to Don Ellis:

    AGREED!
    Thibs habit of playing guys full-quarters+ is an Anti-Spurs approach. Both Popovich and his former lead assistant Budenholzer (now coaching Atlanta) skillfully rotate players in-and-out giving them that short-blow you mention.

    Popovich realized years ago that the NBA season is an ultra-marathon that creates fatigue in players, fatigue that cannot be recovered from until the off-season and therefore greatly affects playoff performance. Avoiding long stretches without a blow is one of Pops' KEY methods for avoiding fatigue in his players.

    Thibs is horrible at this.

  • Look we're all mad, sad and depressed that DRose is hurt again. But venting by whining about McDoug not playing isnt going to help. The guys a rookie and not ready to help the team this year. Get over it. :-)

  • In reply to CN71:

    The problem, CN71, is that Hinrich is not helping the team, and last night neither was Brooks! So, throw the rookie in there and get him some court time so maybe he can develop!

    Fans were venting about this before the latest episode of Derrich Rose's Knees. Why? Because the Bulls need shooters and McDermott is a shooter. They paid for him, so now develop him.

  • In reply to rustyw:

    McDoug hasn't played well this year, but Hinrich has been beyond useless.

    The Hinrich/Brooks backcourt played the first 5:38 of the 4th quarter, and the Bulls scored 11 points:

    2 Butler driving layups
    1 Snell driving layup
    1 Mirotic driving layup
    1 Brooks 3pt (set up and assisted by Mirotic)

    If not for the one-on-one abilities of Butler, Snell and Mirotic, the Bulls would have lost the game right there in that 5:38 stretch. I'll say it again, we won that game last night in spite of Thibs' stubborn, rigid rotations.

  • Looks like Derrick's surgery went well. He walked out of the procedure on his own and is expected to begin rehabbing immediately with a targeted return of 4-6 weeks. If he hits that window, he'll have between 3-9 regular season games to get back into some kind of game shape before the playoffs.

  • In reply to kukoc4cocopuffs:

    Given his past history, 4-6 weeks equals not back this season, and missing some of next pre-season too.

  • In reply to Shakes:

    Only 853 days until Rose's contract expires.

    I'm actually cautiously optimistic that Rose will actually be back before the end of the season. This was such a minor procedure that even his most ardent defenders will start turning on him if he's not back in 6 weeks.

  • fb_avatar
    In reply to Don Ellis:

    Yup. Once he gets cleared by the doctors and if he still refuses to suit up, I wouldn't be surprised that his teammates even turn on him.

    They been busting their butts, coverings for him on the floor and w the media. It's only human nature to be pissed off when/if he decides he needs the summer to rehab so he can be 100%

  • In reply to Don Ellis:

    Unless there is a further medical complication, I would actually bet on him coming back, there is no reason not to, and he really cannot afford the PR hit, just ask Adidas.

  • Rose won't be back this year.
    He will say he has to think about his future then play for his team.

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