Kevin Love and Carmelo Anthony, the all-in, need lots of help plan

Kevin Love and Carmelo Anthony, the all-in, need lots of help plan

There's been a lot of discussion about whether the Bulls should get Carmelo Anthony or Kevin Love, what if they could get both?

First note, this plan requires that Minnesota is willing to trade Love at all [they may not be] and that New York is willing to S&T Anthony to Chicago [they may not be]. On top of that, since both players are moving in trades the amount of assets left to divvy up between them is less.

However, depending on what each team will accept, it isn't completely out of the realm of possibility...

99% out of that realm sure, but not completely.

The Trades to make it happen

Trade #1 Kevin Love to the Bulls for Taj Gibson, Mike Dunleavy, Tony Snell

Trade #2 Carmelo Anthony to the Bulls for Carlos Boozer, Ronnie Brewer, Mike James

Both of these trades match under the 125% +100k rule (just barely). Snell has to be included over Amundson in order to get the salary high enough. The trick is now figuring out what sweetners need to be included with each team to make it work.

For the Wolves, if they're considering the #8 pick in the draft for Love, then Taj Gibson + Snell + Dunleavy + Nikola Mirotic becomes a reasonable offer. Gibson and Dunleavy are both veterans they could use right now to improve while Nikola Mirotic is the big value.

How high they are on the Mirotic is up for debate, but given that he's got to be viewed more highly than Saric that means the overall value of this trade should trump an offer of the #8 pick from Sacramento fairly easily unless they simply hate Mirotic or feel that they won't be able to get him to come over and play for them.

For the Knicks, the Bulls would then send as many first rounders as it takes to get the deal done. Probably #16 and #19 in this draft and perhaps pick from the Kings or our own pick in 2015 or 2016. The trade could be agreed to on draft day but take place after the draft in order to get around the consecutive first trade rules.

What are the Bulls left with?
PG: Derrick Rose
SG: Jimmy Butler
SF: Carmelo Anthony
PF: Kevin Love
C: Joakim Noah

Bench: Greg Smith
Bench: Mini-MLE guy [say we can get D.J. Augustin back at that]
Six Bench slots at the vet min

This is a team awfully similar to the Miami Heat when they came together in terms of front line talent but no depth. Miami managed to find ways to attract other players with the mini mid level and had some additional cap room to work with because their star player were under the cap.

The Bulls will be in a stranglehold immediately because this team will already have a total salary around 82 million and be deep into the luxury tax.

Chicago will need to count on Carmelo accepting less than a max extension to have any flexibility while ponying up a max extension for Kevin Love who'd need to agree to an extension for Chicago to take the risk.

The Bulls would have possibly the best starting five in the league after this trade and would likely be able to find at least one or two guys at the veteran minimum who'd chase rings with large roles assigned to them that could be productive.

They wouldn't need versatile players anymore, but could fill out the roster purely with specialists. Guys who can just shoot or just defend or just rebound etc would still make good additions because of the versatility of your starting five. With three legit superstar scorers, you basically need floor spacers and role players.

Does this have any chance of happening? No, probably not. However, it's not entirely inconceivable. The trade offers noted above are both reasonable to the other teams and represent value similar to (or greater than) they'd get back in deals from other teams under the circumstances their players would have input in the trade destination.

There are three big hang ups to the plan, so the odds of all three working themselves out are slim.
1: Is NY would be willing to do a S&T and take on Boozer's salary [and luxury tax payments] for mid round 1sts which don't help them that much?

2: Is Minnesota willing to trade Love at all?

3: Is Nikola Mirotic willing to go to Minnesota?

If those three things unfold, this plan could become very real.

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  • I realize this is simply for entertainments sake which is cool. Doug himself says this has a 1% chance of happening. There's no way N.Y. would trade Anthony(let along to go into the tax) for picks 16 and 19(plus rainy day Sac's) and basically fertilizer filler in Mike James and Ronnie Brewer along with seriously declining Boozer. That's just not going to happen. As for Love it will be interesting to see what happens on draft night. Will a Boston, L.A., or Orlando be willing to trade a fairly high lotto pick, and feel they can convince Love to resign there?

    If the top six teams, say they can't get a deal done, would Minny consider a package of Mirotic and Taj as the headliners? Honestly if it weren't for Mirotic's long standing reluctance it might. Depending on how high they are on him. Even so Gar/Pax have not shown the ability or inclination to make major deals happen. I wold be shocked if the Chicago Bulls completed a trade for an in their prime big time scorer. In other words I won't be holding my breath/don't need the disappointment. Though If it happens lotto ticket claimed of course.

    Otherwise would the Bulls consider restructuring the team as franchises sometimes do with a draft day trade? Answer: I doubt it. The guy I would trade is Npah, but people here value him more highly then i do or like Doug say we can't get enough/any real value back for him probably partly due to his contract. So likely the Bulls simply use their picks. And just as likely Thibs doesn't play them much which will suck. Thee end.

  • In reply to RoadWarrior:

    Noah's age, health, and lack of offense (along with cost) make him a great player for a team looking to win now, but that team won't have the right type of assets to give us.

    If we're looking to win now, then we won't want different win now assets most likely, and if we're looking to rebuild (we're not, but if we were) that type of team wouldn't have the good picks to make it worth it.

    I think Noah's a good player on a good deal, but I don't think his trade value is great. It's definitely positive, but not elite.

  • In reply to DougThonus:

    Clarifying response. Thanks Doug. Bottom line: I don't think they'd trade him period so for my interests I'm out of luck. I do appreciate your input, and I'm not trying to be a jerk, I'm just a little surprised after you said he did nothing in the playoffs you still think Jo is a "great player for a team looking to win now" when in two of the last four playoffs he shot in the .430's which is winning cancer and he's so oft injured. I just think the contender notion is homeristic/erroneous and the Bulls hold on to guys way too long for the simple fact that the identifiable characters insure the U.C. filling crowd i.e massive profits keep pouring in.

  • In reply to RoadWarrior:

    For 13 million dollars, you get a DMVP caliber player who's also an elite passer, good ball handler, rebounder, and tremendous character guy.

    He's not been great in the playoffs when counted on as a #1 or #2 guy on a team, but a contender probably has him as the fourth option.

  • In reply to DougThonus:

    Doug elite passer, ballhandler?? Come on. Defensively one on one he's not that great. He doesn't score. I mean come on. If u were not a Bulls fan I really doubt you'd be very high on Jo. U said yourself he did nothing in the playoffs and he was largely ineffective against Washington's bigs. I dunno man I know I'm alone on this one, but I would trade him if I could get say Afflallo and the No. 14 from Orlando. Keep Taj, amnesty Boozer, and hope between the draft and Mirotic plus Rose coming back healthy we can reinvigorate a horrid offense. We need a big who can shoot/score like Payne with 7'0 wingspan even at 30 mpg I'll take him. We are no way near contender as in rookies/the future we need cheap and real offensive players.

  • In reply to RoadWarrior:

    Your focus on Noah as an offensive player is becoming quite myopic. It takes a properly constructed team to win a championship, with guys knowing and playing their roles. Noah is not the Bulls problem on offense, everybody else/health is the problem. With a proper set of scoring wings and an healthy Rose, Noah is definitely a championship caliber asset. You think that Miami wouldn't love to have him.

    As for Payne, I'd love the Bulls to take him, and I'd do so at 16, but he is simple not a center, even in today's NBA. There doesn't seem to be a single legitimate center in the first half of this draft, and certainly none who could start for a championship contender this season, so getting rid of Noah because of his offensive deficiencies is cutting off your nose to spite your face.

    The only validity that I can see in your crusade to rid the Bulls of Noah is that he is almost certainly at his peak, and he could very well decline quickly, so you would be maximizing his trade value.

    But again, Noah is the absolute least of the Bulls problems going forward.

  • In reply to DougThonus:

    totally agree on your take on Noah. The question is, is his trade value greater than Taj's or Mirotic's, particularly when considered visa'vi his value to the Bulls.

  • Hang up #4) Will the Bulls do this and jump right into the luxury tax at $82 mil?

    $82 mil is just barely over the tax that I think is going to be around $77k and should be rising each year.

    Still, a tall order.

    This would be like Ainge's pull back in the summer of '07. GM driven talent grab, not player driven. We have not seen anything like it since.

    Roadwarrior - I do not value Noah as much as others, too. Simply because he is not a guy who can score and single handedly take over a game. His salary is decent, but he'll want more money after two more season.

    HOWEVER, Noah on this team is idea because his scoring is not needed. He's a 4th or 5th option offensively.

    I think you put this plan in front of all parties:

    Mirotic would come to Minn for a big enough contract. Gibson + Mirotic is pretty damn good. I do not think that Vonleh, Gordon or Randle will be better than Gibson. Gibson is better now and will be for the next 3-4 years for sure.

    Minn will trade Love if he demands it and tells them for sure he's leaving.

    NY will trade Melo if he will not sign and the Knicks get the picks mentioned. That's 2 mid-1sts and Sactown's pick. Throw in another Chicago 1st - but try to hold on to the 2015 pick b/c it could be mid 1st as well if we swap with CLE.

    I think Love and Melo need to take a bit less. Like $17-18 mil instead of $20-22 mil. Didn't the Heat trio sign for $14 mil each in 2010? Rose will need to take a bit less too when he's up - assuming he comes back close to what he was.

  • The 2014-15 estimated tax is 77 million, the 82 million is for 2015-16, so they're pretty deep into the tax.

  • Side note: News on the draft front, Jordan Adams, according to historically fairly accurate, has fallen right out of the first round all the way down to 34. Am I surprised by this? Yes. Shocked? Can't say I am. Combine numbers don't always matter that much, but as I said before if there is a question hanging over a player as in concern, and the combine dramatically confirms those worries then it can be impactful.

    Adams 3/4 court sprint was 3.50 which is awful really and his MAX(not standing) Vert was 29 which for a SG/wing is a joke. Like I said before I still think with his long(6'10) wingspan and his overall game will translate with exceptional steals, rebounds, field goal percentage, and prolific scoring in a reinvigorated major in the Pac-12. Plus he's a quality kid.

    Still, if Hood and Young are gone and Payne is available at 16 or 19 do you grab him then go after say Napier/Wilcox or do you actually trade down(?) the 19 for say No.'s 23 and 32 taking say C.J. Wilcox PLUS Adams? Then out of Payne, Wilcox, and Adams very possibly you've hit on one if not two players as legit contributors and efficient quality offense guys. Doubt Gar/Pax would do this though. Sucks that Hood and Young are just out of reach.. but isn't this always the case with the draft?

  • In reply to RoadWarrior:

    Watched just about every game that Young played this year and I'm not sold on him being all that good. Not a great passer or defender. Not a great athlete - decent, not great. Shooting is above average, but for a guy that we were told was "one of the best shooters in the NCAA" going into the year he sure was less than advertised.

    Hood is definitely a better shooter, but limited motor and athletic ability. Nice size. Hood and Payne would be nice at 16 and 19, but I would not blow a nut over those two guys. I'd be pretty excited if we could land Stauskas, however. I think he has more of a motor and scorer's mentality. Best shooter, hands down and can create a bit. Definitely more than Hood.

  • In reply to Granby:

    I'd go for quality over quantity - so using both picks to trade up slightly for Stauskas would be a top priority based on best available player and best fit for the Bulls roster - even with Melo.

    Also, saves cap money for Melo.

    I think they'll end up with Melo, I really do.

  • In reply to Granby:

    Well I'm glad u would not "blow a nut" over those two guys. I really am.

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    In reply to RoadWarrior:

    umm, eww...just eww.

  • In reply to Granby:

    From all that I've read we'd be lucky to get both Hood and Payne at 16 & 19. There is a good chance that they are both gone by 16. We'd all probably prefer Stauskis or McDermott as elite shooting is our biggest need, but they seem like definite lottery picks.

    The Bulls would be likely be better off taking a chance on the talent of a guy like Lavine instead of Hood, but he seems like one of those guys that is going to rise up into the lottery with his individual workouts.

  • In reply to BigWay:

    Thibs would never play LaVine. And don't be surprised if McDermott is the big name dropping on draft night. All the way to the Bulls at 16. I just hope they have the wisdom to pass him up and take Payne instead. McDermott measured 6'6 1/2" at the combine. He would have value as a stretch four. Now he has none.

  • In reply to sfpaper:

    I thought the same thing about McDermott, somewhat typical of the leading scorer in college making it as pro. However, his athletic numbers were better than expected at the Chicago camp and he seems to be a guy who will interview and work out well. Not sure than anyone ever thought of him as a four, he is definitely a wing, the only question is which one.

    The Bulls need elite shooting, apparently either he or Stauskis are the best pure shooters in the draft, so if either guy is there at 16 you have to seriously consider him. Like you I would have a hard time not taking Payne at 16 even if McDermott lasts that long.

    My question was more McDermott vs Hood. Hood is starting to sound a bit Luol Dengish. Also with Butler on the team, we really need a guy who is a legitimate shooting guard, don't know if Hood is that. Don't know about McDermott either, that's why I brought up Lavine, even though he fancies himself as a pg.

    Anyway, looking at just about every mock out there, it really doesn't look like any of those guys make it to 16, although it only takes 1 or 2 surprise picks ahead of us to allow one to drop to us.

  • In reply to BigWay:

    I think there is a decent chance the Bulls plan to trade away a pick or stash a Euro at 19. I am hoping they move up to the 10-12 range and take Stauskas.

  • Melo's salary for 2013-14 was $21,388,593.
    If he doesn't opt out, the salary for his final contract year 2014-15 with Knicks is $23,333,404.

    Phil has already said he's expecting Melo to take a pay cut in his next contract. And, imo, I find it unlikely any other team pays Melo in the $20s. So why is Melo indicating he will opt out? Because I don't see Melo getting that $23.3 number in any new contract, Knicks or elsewhere. Why doesn't he just play another year on his current contract at $23.3 and extend, or not extend and be a FA next year?

    He wants a higher salary? (if so I think Melo will be disappointed).
    One extra year if he opts out and resigns with Knicks, instead of extending with Knicks? (that doesn't seem enough to bother with after Phil told him he'll get a pay cut in his next contract).

    Or is opting out because Melo truly wants to change teams?
    Has Melo officially opted out yet? Could he change his mind?

  • In reply to Edward:

    I agree. Knicks already said he'll have to take less. Nobody (Houston, LA, Chicago) that has been talked about as potential suitors has the ability to offer him max. Houston may be able to if they work some trades, but I doubt they would since it appears that nobody else will give the max.

    Chicago is sitting pretty if they can clear some more space - dumping Dunleavy and Snell and possibly one of their picks gets them in the game. If Thibs is still coaching and Noah is recruiting and Rose is (FINALLY!) healthy, Chicago is VERY attractive. (Key would be Rose staying healthy - and if Melo buys into that, I can't seem him staying in NY. Maybe Houston, but it's still Houston and then you're battling in the competitive Western Conf!)

  • In reply to Edward:

    He hasn't opted out yet, he can wait until June 30th I believe to decide.

    I do think you're right though, he wants to change teams.

  • In reply to DougThonus:

    I think Melo wants another max contract - both years and dollars. I don't think he cares where it comes from. And I think there is very little chance he ends up on the Bulls. Bottom line is that he is all the Knicks have. Phil suggested he take less. But Melo is holding the cards, and Phil has zero momentum and no draft pick. He will pay the man.

  • In reply to Edward:

    Interestingly from the Wall Street Journal today, looks like Phil is thinking along the same lines.

    "Now Jackson is doing what he can to make sure Carmelo Anthony is still a Knick next season—and beyond. Jackson said that he asked Anthony to consider opting into the final year of his contract, as opposed to becoming a free agent this summer. Anthony, who has indicated for months that he would opt out of the deal and test the free-agent market, told Jackson that he would give the idea due consideration".

    "By playing one season in the Jackson regime, Anthony could take stock of whether the Knicks have made any forward progress, potentially make more money (his next deal could start at a higher maximum salary if he opts in), and have a better sense of any other big-name free agents he might be playing with in the future. The Knicks should have considerable salary-cap space come next season, and Anthony, who is due $23.5 million next season, could play a part in trying to recruit stars to New York."

    "I've told him it might be a good idea to hang in here and see what it's like for a year, and go on to next year," Jackson said. "But that's his option. That's what he's earned, and part of his contractual agreement. He has the right to [opt out]. But I just offered that to give him an opportunity to see how this is going to change…with the coaching, the system and the culture we impose."

  • In reply to BigWay:

    Unless Melo has absolutely made up his mind to leave, this would seem like the reasonable thing to do. Maybe Phil has changed or will change his mind.

    Plus his new deal if he opts out this summer can "only" start at $22.5 million vs the $23.3 that he is under contract for now, and his new contract next summer could start at $24.5 million.

    So he is basically "giving up" over a million per year just by opting out this summer, and we want him to give up another $4 million per on top of that to sign with the Bulls.

    I'd say the Bulls chances of getting Melo are barely higher than were our chances of landing Lebron in 2010, of course we didn't know it at the time, but they were close to zero.

  • In reply to BigWay:

    I should have read your posts before commenting. Agree fully.

  • One BIG question: Is Love worth more than Taj and Mirotic together? Because he certainly is going to cost more. (Dunleavy and Snell are basically throw-ins, but they do have some value.)

    Taj will start next season and Mirotic likely will in a year if not immediately. If Mirotic signs for $5 million per, together they cost about $13+ million. Love will be about $17 million, but his extension should be higher, so figure about $5 million additional per year for Love. Plus the Bulls lose Dunleavy. I am not sold on this one.

    Besides, If Melo would sign for $16 or $18 million per, then the Bulls do not need to do an S&T to get him, so they keep their picks!

    Instead of your lineup, Doug,

    PG: Derrick Rose
    SG: Jimmy Butler
    SF: Carmelo Anthony
    PF: Kevin Love
    C: Joakim Noah

    the Bulls have Taj where Love is at PF, but they also have Mirotic on the bench for a year maybe, and Dunleavy, plus they have a number of picks.

    So, Taj won't score like Love, but he won't give up points on D like Love! And he costs half of Love. Taj is a better value, if we want to play money ball. If Taj and Mirotic both turn into 17/8 guys, with Melo dropping 30/8 per game, plus Noah, that is a deadly front court on both ends.

    And, I would think with all their picks they ought to be able to get 2 or 3 SGs and hope they hit on one! Or trade up for Stauskas. Some mocks have him available at #16.

  • In reply to rustyw:

    The answer to your first question is almost certainly. He's definitely worth it if the Bulls want to compete in the Derrick Rose era as it gives you maximum value over the next couple of years.

  • In reply to rustyw:

    You can't get Melo at $16 without dumping Dunleavy and Snell and both this years firsts, you can't get him for $18 without dumping Butler too. Go back a few days and look at Edwards posts on clearing cap space to get Melo. Other than the true final cost of Noah and maybe Taj depending on their bonuses earned this year his numbers tell the story. Don't forget that Melo's new contract can start at $22.5 million per, so $16-18 is a hell of a pay cut.

  • In reply to BigWay:

    Look, we all know Melo can hypothetically get more elsewhere, tho even NY says they will want him to take a discount!

    Melo says he wants to win more than the money. He can have BOTH with Chi because of endorsements for leading the team to titles. Therefore he would not be taking "a hell of a pay cut."

    That does not mean I believe him, but I base certain scenarios on what he said.

  • By the time the weekend is over this topic should break your record for most responses. Do you even know what that record is currently.

    I can even believe that the Bulls might be thinking about pulling this off right now, hoping to make up for the failure of the 2010 plan.

    Obviously, if you can make it happen you should be willing to give up every single asset that we have besides Rose and Noah, maybe you even give up Noah too. I don't think that Butler is untouchable in this scenario.

    You hit on most of the major obstacles. With the biggest hurdle to clear being the Knicks willingness to take boozer back at a cost of somewhere between $42 and $50 million depending on what tiers of the tax the boozer money falls under. That seems like a huge amount to pay for a deal that brings them no basketball value back, just draft picks, 3 would seem to be the minimum. They would probably ask for Mirotic also, which would submarine the Minny deal.

    This idea seems within the realm of possibilities, but I think it could only happen if Love and Melo got together and "forced" their teams to trade them to the Bulls as a package deal. I wonder what kind of relationship if any Love and Melo have, my guess is that they are not "superfriends".

  • In reply to BigWay:

    No idea what the record is, but in the 2010 LeBron FA era, I had something like 2 million page views in the month of July which is what I get in a typical year now.

    I'd imagine whatever the record was, it was set back then.

  • I think all these trade ideas are crazy with all due respect. D. Rose is going to need to get back to star level (which is what the Bulls need from him to win a championship). This is a transition year. The Bulls goal should be to position the team for a true championship run in the 2015-16 season. No need to amnesty Boozer, his contract will roll off naturally after this year, and the Bulls will need his scoring off the bench. Mirotic is most likely not coming until next year, at which point he can replace Boozer with a cheaper/better option. Butler should take another step this year as well, and he should be re-signed this year. If the Bulls are serious about Love, then a year of starting for Taj should make him a higher value trade chip this year, and a Bulls team on the rise, with Rose proving he's back over the course of the year, Noah doing Noah, Butler taking another step, the incoming 1st round youngsters, and Mirotic coming in should help to lure Love to the Bulls as a Free Agent....or Taj's added value as a starter (and hopefully the improved offensive stats to match) might make it easier to use him & Boozer as the basis of a deal for Love at the trade deadline as the Wolves should be more desperate then, Boozer's contract would be soon expiring, and Taj could be a potential PF starter replacement under contract for 2 more years at $8.5 & $8.95 mil, which is a value contract.

  • In reply to Ghost Dawg:

    You are depressing. No Melo... No Mirotic... Keeping the Hole for another year? Transition year? Just kill me now.

    Gibson's value won't get much higher after how he played to finish out the season. Even if he's slightly better next year, he's a year older and his contract is part of why he's so valuable and there are currently 3 years left and next year there would be only 2. (Yes, I am awesome at math!)

  • In reply to Ghost Dawg:

    The Bulls have nothing they can do next year. They won't have good cap room and will need to reup Butler. If Rose isn't back this season coming up, then odds are he's simply never coming back.

  • Speaking of opt-outs, Anthony morrow is opting out of his contract with Nawlins'. Could be a solid pickup for the Bulls at the right price.He shot 45.1 percent from three last season, good for fourth in the NBA in three-point accuracy. He also had five 20+ point games in the last couple of weeks last season, so he has potential. Between Morrow & Korver, the Bulls could have 2 of the top 4 three point shooters in the NBA, and one of them always on the floor. You could also play both at times and really spread the floor.

  • In reply to Ghost Dawg:

    I like where you're heads at here... Thibs needs to utilize Korver though. I like Morrow.

  • In reply to Ghost Dawg:

    Morrow can do nothing but shoot, but if we could land him then that'd be nice. I doubt we'll have a competitive offer though.

  • In reply to Ghost Dawg:

    Did the Bulls trade for Korver(and his $6+ salary) while we were sleeping.

  • In reply to BigWay:

    I had the same question.

  • In reply to rustyw:

    We all did

  • As it looks right now Payne will definitely be available at 16. That could possibly change, but I doubt it. And while people may think I'm bagging on Noah with the right team I'd be fine with him as Doug said probably the fourth best player. He looked like a winner playing with LeBron in the all-star game. It's just that with his money and with the Bulls who are so offensively decrepit I really want offensive talent at every position which means Jimmy Butler and Noah on starters money are gone. Offensively I think they both suck not passing but scoring/shooting.

    Honestly after long enough I get tired of the same guys unless they're HOF's/prennial legit all-stars I mean who/how often does a team do that? Deng, Noah these guys were around here for an eternity though Noah can't score and Deng couldn't shoot 3's which is critical for a wing. Again, I think the "family" aspect and fans filling the U.C. to see the kids is why they stay. If not for Thibs regular season winning defense machine some of these guys would have been gone way before now IMO.

  • In reply to RoadWarrior:

    I certainly hope that you are right on Payne lasting until 16, that seems a bit optimistic to me. However, I see no connection whatsoever between getting Payne and Noah's lack of offensive star power, other than than Payne would look very good playing next to Noah at power forward. He is probably more offensively talented, especially in today's game than Taj Gibson, who is the guy that Payne would most likely replace long term, if Mirotic doesn't beat him to the punch.

  • In reply to RoadWarrior:

    Yes, The Bulls are simply not a team that's built for playoff success. Thibs grinding provides us with a regular-season-illusion. And we fans and the media repeatedly get suckered into believing and caring while while watching that illusion. But that illusion has and always will get exposed in the playoffs.

    And now as we're ruminating about the draft and about Bulls desperate need to acquire playoff-type talent, I ask myself, why again was it Bulls didn't tank to get into the lottery after Rose was injured? Because all us pro-tankers knew the cold-hard-truth, that a high draft pick was and is the most viable way to acquire playoff-level talent. And tanking to improve your own draft position expends 0 assets, unlike all these trade scenarios. In fact, tanking is asset creation.

    Winning 1 single playoff game and the 19th pick? Really? That was worth missing a top 10 pick and a Cleveland chance at a lottery ball? This was the FO's decision! And talk about a bad decision on what was a tiny window of a month or so in which Bulls had to make that decision.

    Deng trade was awesome, but don't sign Augustin. Instead, keep and play Teague, play Snell, play Eric Murphy some, as these are the honest results of Bulls draft position. And presto, we'd all be talking about the Bulls realistic 2014-15 improvement options instead of the fiction we're now discussing. Fiction! Like watching the Thibs regular-season-illusion, Fiction!

  • In reply to Edward:

    I'm not sure that's fair given we've only seen a healthy Rose once in the playoffs with a decent cast around him, and they played miami pretty evenly.

  • In reply to ChiRy:

    Yes, that was the most even single win (1-4) playoff series ever....

  • In reply to Edward:

    but I agree about the tanking

  • The knicks are basically rebuilding if Carmelo opts to leave right? Why would it be crazy to think they would not be willing to accept boozer in a trade? The knicks need assets.. so i could see them taking boozer just to get picks and flipping him at the deadline to get rid of salary and possibly get something in return even if it's not much to team looking to improve playoff chances. Which would not hinder them with luxury tax...either way they would be paying tax with or without melo the team will still suck so Why not acquire assets if he leaves.

  • In reply to bullzfan:

    It would cost them between $42-50 million for one year of boozer, some might call that crazy.

  • In reply to BigWay:

    True, but it depends on Phil's plan. I'm in the group that thinks his is a 2015 plan, tank the hell out of this season and get a top-5 pick in the 2015 draft to go with ~$50 million in cap space.

    If he keeps Melo, they have the same team as this year, meaning they won't be anywhere near a contender, and they won't get a good draft pick either.

    What better way to tank than to play Boozer 30+ minutes a night? Put him and Bargnani on the floor together, and you have the worst defense in NBA history.

  • In reply to Don Ellis:

    Totally agree that Phil has a 2015 plan, he really has no other option, just don't know if he thinks that Melo is part of the 2015 plan. Obviously he can't just come out and say that he isn't.

    I'd actually have to watch Knicks games on league pass just to laugh my ass off at a boozer, bargnani front court, that would be epically horrific. But still even in Manhattan $50 million is a lot to pay for a clown act.

  • In reply to BigWay:

    Play them 30 minutes a night together and Boozer would average 20 rebounds, since Bargs wouldn't be taking any of them... and Boozer would look like a good defender playing next to either Bargnani or Ama'r'e''!

  • In reply to Don Ellis:

    With those guys playing D, there won't be 20 defensive rebounds available since it will be a layup drill all night.

  • In reply to BigWay:

    LOL, you're 100% correct, I forget about that!!

  • In reply to BigWay:

    And it would be more taxes with Melo for a team that's still won't why not get what you can?!! It's not crazy considering the situation they are in...still possibility to trade him at can't totally dismiss that

  • Doug, what am I missing that would force the Bulls to add salary to Gibson and Dunleavy in order to take back Love?

    The new CBA allows non-taxpaying teams to take back the outgoing salary plus $5 million as long as they are under the tax when the trade is completed (which the Bulls would be). Love makes $15.7 million, Taj and Dunleavy combined make $11.3 million.

  • In reply to Don Ellis:

    I had the Bullls as over the tax due to the Melo trade going first, but you're right if the Love trade goes first, then it would work out okay for Chicago to have to add in other fillers.

  • In reply to DougThonus:

    Thanks for the clarification, to me it just makes sense that the Love deal would go down first, because a Melo sign and trade couldn't be official with the league until the July Moratorium passes, while a Love trade can take place at any time.

  • More than a little bit surprised that nobody asked, but can Melo and Love co-exist, are there really enough basketballs to go around for both of those guys and Rose? Are they all smart enough to put their ego's aside and figure it out?

  • In reply to BigWay:

    You would hope they are smart enough to look at Miami and realize that it's not that hard to make it work, if all 3 guys are committed to winning.

    Especially Love and Melo, they each want out of their current situation because they don't have enough help.

  • Gotta know when to shoot and when to pass, especially when there would be at least one other shooter on the team. Figure it out guys, you two need each other. But all of this is moot if they both do not wind up in Chicago.

    Eventually the Bulls will wind up other shooters and they will have to work it out then to become champs.

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