Marquis Teague to the D-League [though on hold] makes little sense

Marquis Teague to the D-League [though on hold] makes little sense

The Chicago Bulls gave up on Teague quickly, and under normal circumstances (like trying to compete to win the title) I would hardly blame them. Under these circumstances, Chicago has the perfect opportunity to develop Teague against real NBA talent.

Now it's worth noting, the Bulls had to cancel the move because of an injury to Mike James who suffered a sprained MCL in the last game and yet still played through it [so much for our thoughts on the medical staff improving their decision making].

However, the fact that circumstances forced them to cancel doesn't change much about the signals the move sent.

The Bulls are done with Teague

Chicago doesn't use the D-League to develop players. Not since Martynas Andriuskevicius was knocked out by Awvee Storey suffering a fractured skull, severe concussion, brain hematoma, and never suited up for the Bulls. Granted Andruiskevicius was never a stellar prospect, but the injury effectively ended his pro basketball career.

Not hard to see why the Bulls think the D-League may not be a worthwhile investment. I've also always felt that practicing against inferior players doesn't do much to help you improve against vastly superior ones. The D-League MVP is a borderline NBA call up, and typically being sent down to the D-League just means you stink.

There are likely a few D-League success stories here and there, but they're few and far between. Given the Bulls relationship with the D-League, I think it's safe to infer that it's over for Teague in Chicago, and that if the Bulls can't move him this off-season (even just for cap room) that they won't pick up his option for his fourth year.

Management isn't tanking

Of course Gar Forman went on the Waddle and Silvy show and steadfastly denied tanking, but what else could he say? If he ever admitted to tanking the league would likely strip the draft choice away anyway. As such, these types of words really don't mean much or signal anything to the fan.

The move of Teague to the D-League does signal something to the fans though. It signals that the Bulls aren't interested in "developing prospects" that might hurt them in their play right now. It's hardly be viewed as a crazy decision to order Tom Thibodeau to develop Teague rather than play Mike James, a move which likely isn't going to help out the win column much the way Teague has performed so far.

However, the Bulls are going to go with an aged veteran who clearly isn't in the teams future plans in any meaningful way because he'll help them win games now. In this case, it appears the Bulls brass is having a hard time letting go.

The season is gone, but they're still trying to hang on and find some meaning. Last season when Chicago had hope that Rose would come back at the end of the season this made some sense. Rebuilding immediately would have signaled the end of what could have potentially been a strong playoff year if Rose had returned healthy in February or March, a likely scenario (though obviously it didn't happen).

Even if management felt the odds of winning in such a scenario were limited due to rust and continuity, there was the case that they'd at least have all the pieces and you never know.

That's not the case now. This season is a complete dead end. As such, it's time to let go on the idea that a 1st round exit is meaningful. Especially given the strength of the draft class this year relative to last year.

While seemingly unrelated...

That also means the extremely aggressive moves to unload win now players who won't be here next season is unlikely to happen. To me, the clear choice this season is to trade Hinrich and Deng (assuming Deng won't be back, which if he's back management deserves another crack on the skull for not doing the deal this summer when it'd be three years instead of four).

Neither guy helps your future core, both guys help you avoid getting a superstar in this draft. Your tickets are already sold out, and the Bulls can likely balance off any merchandise/concession losses on no shows with saved money in luxury tax/salary payments.

The Memphis Grizzlies could use a backup PG and could take on Hinrich with a trade exception. As could the Nuggets/Thunder/Warriors though those teams may not feel the same need. Still, for a team chasing a title this year, adding Kirk Hinrich for a late 2nd round pick could be a pretty sweet deal and is something that could likely be completed.

I've proposed a few Deng trade scenarios, and Deng's continued quality play makes a trade more possible, but there aren't many suitors out there who have a need, an asset to give up, and short term salary that matches to send back to Chicago.

One interesting scenario would be to swap Hinrich/Deng for Paul Pierce, but the Nets simply don't have anything to throw in to sweeten the deal and make the trade work since they've traded all their draft picks already.

All in all, I hope management comes around

Moving Deng/Hinrich in a dead season where the players are clearly unmotivated and playing for the draft isn't going to kill the culture. Hinrich, Deng, and Noah all lived through the 07/08 season when the Bulls completely fell apart and quit. It didn't impact their long term culture as players. They're still hard working guys.

The Bulls can't win the title in 2014, but they can best prepare themselves to do so in 2015 and beyond. It's time to start that process and Teague to the D-League when he could be in charge of generating some losses and potentially proving himself an NBA caliber player and improving his trade value isn't helping that cause.

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  • What if.. the reason they refuse to do the right thing and tank... Is because they believe Rose will be back this season?

    That being said, I saw the rust just like you... I still think the season is a lost one regardless.

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    In reply to Swish14U:

    I agree....I still think it's a long shot, but the reason they ruled Rose out immediately is due to the backlash that they got for not declaring him out last year. Just because they declared him out, it doesn't mean he can't come back. There is no season ending IR in basketball he's been placed on. The longer they go on trying to win without trading anyone or playing young players, the more convinced they are that he can come back for the playoffs. With the 4-6 month timeframe, he could come back anywhere from late march to late May.

    That being said, what they did last year is the best predictor of what they will do this year, so I give it about a 5% chance that he'll be coming back...."So you're telling me there's a chance;-)"

  • In reply to Swish14U:

    Seems like a silly thought to expect Rose to come back this season or make any plans with that in mind. Even if he were to return, he wouldn't be at the level required to have a real playoff run.

  • In reply to DougThonus:

    Exactly, Rose is easily going to need half a season to find his groove.

  • I'm not sure how much Teague is supposed to help the tank job- he's only been on the floor for 69 minutes this season, but the Bulls have outscored their opponents by 2 points in that time.

    And that number would be higher, if not for 9 minutes of -9 with a garbage time lineup of James-Teague-Snell-Murphy-Mohammed.

    They have been outscored by 15 points the rest of the time (I think this is through 13 games per 82games.com).

    I'm certainly not saying that the Bulls are a better team with Teague on the floor instead of on the bench or in the D-League, but the limited statistical proof we have so far this season surely says it.

  • In reply to Don Ellis:

    +/- is a pretty much crap statistic. It's especially crap with low sample size.

  • In reply to DougThonus:

    I know, that's why I threw in the last paragraph as a disclaimer. Just because I'm one of the few who hasn't given up on Teague doesn't mean that I'm not aware that he sucks big donkey balls right now.

  • In reply to Don Ellis:

    While I agree Teague will someday be a legitimate NBA player, its becoming more and more clear it will be on a team other than the Bulls.

  • In reply to DougThonus:

    That's a perfect match as Paducahville is a crap statistician and +/- is one of his favorites he uses regularly to crap all over people on your excellent blog - since he has nobody to crap on at his own crappy blog.

  • I don't understand their thinking. It's clear what the best moves are for the future. You have to trade Deng and Hinrich and get something for them since you have zero chance of winning a championship with Rose out. Even if he was healthy the odds were bleak. Trade everyone that won't be on the team in two years and retool this summer. Give Teague, Snell and Butler all the minutes they can handle if nothing else should boost their trade value if you don't like one of them.

    keeping the team intact and playing vets on one year deals is just plain stupid. Of coarse Thibs will push for this route its the coaches job to win every game he can. Its GarPax's job to make the moves and put pressure on him to play the young guys they are interested in developing.

  • In reply to Chad:

    They tried to get a 1st for him and failed. I'd guess at this point they might not even be able to get a second or even find a team to just take him with a trade exception.

  • There must be no market for Teague right now via trade. Otherwise, they would have dumped him for a future 1st or even current/future 2nd round pick.

    I'm surprised that they could not have gotten more after the summer league. I was not overly impressed based on his game this summer, but he did show some signs of improvement - mostly his shooting and lower turnovers. Still, Goudelock looked like the best player on the floor except for maybe one game.

    Were the Bulls still holding out hope for an improved Teague after the summer league? Was there no market for Teague even then? 28 teams passed on Teague in the 2012 draft and Teague showed nothing outside of some basic life in the recent summer league, so it's not surprising that teams would not be interested.

  • Knowing the Bulls, I'd be shocked to see them dump Hinrich and Deng. It's just not their style. It makes no sense to press forward with vets to attain the 6th or 7th seed in the East, but I can see GarPax trying to win. It could be the difference between the 9th pick (or better if we get lucky in the lotto) and 18th pick... annoying.

  • In reply to Granby:

    It is annoying for at least 2 reasons:
    1) Because trading Deng and Hinrich now could improve the draft picks next spring, and that bodes well for the long term future of the team. IMO, failing to make such a move is foolish, unless they plan to do it closer to the trade deadline when they hope to get a bit more for those guys.
    2) By playing Snell and Teague more, they either develop them or find out they are not worth developing. This likely increases their trade value, though I don't see them trading Snell.

  • Teague stinks, always have stunk and he should've been gone a long time ago but for some dumb reason or bad luck, the Bulls can't get rid of this bust. Just watching other teams play and the scorers that they have, I have always said that the Bulls absolutely stink when it comes to their offense and it is showing immensely. The two idiots GarPax are still talking about extending Deng...WHY!!! Deng needs to be traded to a team with championship goals for future picks or a player that can create his own shot. This team is sickening and I haven't watched a game since Rose injury. I didn't grow up playing or watching the type of basketball that this bulls team play. There was always more than one guy that could score when needed. I guess I'm just too disappointed in the things that's happened this season and don't really see much improvements fir the future unless some sort of moves are made this season.

  • In reply to Reese1:

    Definitely agree that Deng should be traded since he will cost too much to extend.

    I suppose the argument for resigning Deng is that the team can only develop so much youth at one time. So, Mirotic and the 2 1st round picks will all have a NBA adjustment period. I still believe they should tank the season and trade Deng for some kind of 1st rounder. With 3 1st rounders, they may be able to make a nice move up on draft day.

  • we'll see what he does with his second chance now that thib favorite mike james is down for a few weeks. He's said in the past he can get to the rim.........problem is he can't finish, doesn't have a floater and doesn't use his left hand. He worked all summer on his 3pt shot and jumpshooting which showed in summerleague but disappeared in the early season. He still has potential but when his passing and ball handling aren't great either, you start to think he doesn't belong at all in the NBA. You got to have something, shooting, ball handling/passing since raw speed/athleticism won't get it done at this level. When the Bulls do draft another point guard in the upcoming draft, hopefully they go with someone who has size(6'5") and a few years college experience. Paxson usually does well with experienced college players.

  • At this point, you can't trade Hinrich until the trade deadline at the earliest. If you do trade him any earlier, you stunt the growth of Butler, Gibson, Snell and even Teague if there is any chance he will develop. Hinrich is exactly the guy you want running the team, putting guys in the right spot and getting them the ball, being a professional every day, and ultimately missing a wide open three to win the game like he did last game.

  • I think the Bulls FO is listening to the coach and to the contingent of fans who don't want the Bulls to tank. Despite watching the Bulls lose to the Cavs, the Jazz and the Davis-less Pelicans, the FO believes they've built a team that can compete for a playoff spot and feels it owes it to season ticket holders and to that small contingent of fans to try their best to win, future be damned. I can't come up with any other explanation. If it turns out to be true, then I'll join the Bulls-FO-is-the-worst-in-the-history-of-NBA-basketball bandwagon that most of the folks around here are on.

  • In reply to Roman F:

    you don't want to establish a culture of losing since it will likely keep going with the coach losing the player's trust and things can get out of hand. I have no problem with Thibodeau and Forman wanting to win with what they have but they should explore trades like Deng for Waiters if available. I think they can be competitive and still look for future assets. Jimmy Butler is a natural small forward so a Deng for younger shooting guard/shot creator makes perfect sense.

  • In reply to Defense-Rebound13:

    I don't think you establish a culture of losing in one year of tanking after the team's superstar went out for the year with injury.

  • In reply to Roman F:

    I agree, that 'culture of losing' business is over blown. Either you have a roster with enough talent to win or you don't. Few teams had the 'culture of losing' of the Clippers. Just add talent and a good coach and BAM, no more culture of losing.

  • In reply to Defense-Rebound13:

    C'mon man. Stop talking about "culture of losing"... this is absurd.

  • Maybe we can trade Teague to Philly for Tony Wroten, who was available for nothing this past summer. Ooops, can't do that since Wroten who is 6'5" and an athlete has averaged nearly 20ppg in the games that he started for the injured MCW, despite the fact that everyone agrees he can't shoot, which would make him the perfect bull.

    While I am definitively on the tank bandwagon, watching Teague play is even more excruciatingly painful than watching Hinrich go 0-8 from 3.

    Nate Robinson hurt his hand/wrist last night, maybe that makes him available.

    When Jimmy comes back, we could play Snell at the point, irregardless of how good(or not) Snell eventually becomes, he doesn't have point guard skills, certainly not as a rookie, which would greatly help the tank effort while still possibly being entertaining to watch.

    This Bulls management team is not trading Deng even if a good deal were to present itself, and even if he walks next summer, so we are going to have to find something else to talk about.

    How about this. Now that Indy has finally lost to someone else, they only have to go 57-7 to break the 96 Bulls record.

  • In reply to BigWay:

    Yeah, Tony Wroten!!

    So what if his team is 1-3 in those 4 starts, or that those 19.5 points are on .429 FG, .143 3's, .571 FT and a .474 TS%.

    Oh wait, I forgot the negatives only apply to Deng and Boozer...

  • In reply to Don Ellis:

    Number one, I was just throwing out shit, since who the fuck cares about the life and times of Marquis "mope a dope" Teague a lifetime scrub if he is lucky, most likely out of the league in a couple of years.

    But yeah Tony Wroten, who is essentially a rookie, since he didn't play a minute last season who leads one of the worst teams(rosters) in the league to a 1-3 record over those 4 starts, kind of like 10 year veteran, 2 time allstar Luol Deng has lead his roster of allstars and future HOFers to a 1-4 record over the best 5 games of his career. So what if the Bulls are 1-4, whoopie, Deng is putting up the best stats of his career, covering up for boozer.

    Again, we're talking about a guy to replace Teague, the 13th man on our roster and a D leaguer, not a 10 year starter with over 700 games under his belt. Get some perspective before you get your snarky schuckfuck face on.

    By the way genius, what is Luol Dengs FG percentage over his last two seasons, not his last 4 games. Guess what genius, it is less than .429, in fact he couldn't even reach that level in either of his last 2 seasons, despite being an allstar and playing with a cast of allstars. So why the fuck would we want a guy like that for 4 more years @ 12-13-14 million per.

    I know that you are smarter than all 30 NBA front offices, put together, but why did Tony Wroten go 8-10 picks sooner that your butt buddy Teague. Tony Wroten will last longer in the NBA than Marquis Teague ever will, book it, bet on it. Maybe they all got together and did it so that you would have another opportunity to prove that you are smarter than everybody else, ever, yea I think thats the reason.

    Keep up the great work, I'm getting closer to showing up at the local Paducahville Y evertime that you post.

  • In reply to BigWay:

    And why have so many people forgotten that the Bulls' offense was MORE EFFICIENT last season with non-shot-creator Kirk on the floor (106.2 pts/100 poss) than with shot-creating superstar Nate (105.9 pts/100 poss) on the floor?

    Yes, Kirk and 4 other non-shot-creators managed to score at a more efficient rate than shot-creating Nate, you read that right.

    If what a lot of folks write on this blog were accurate, the offense should have been AT LEAST 5 points per 100 possessions better, if not 10 per 100, depending on the delusion level of the writer.

    That's not even mentioning how much better the defense was with Kirk on the floor instead of Nate...

    How does that happen? If you don't know enough about basketball to answer the question for yourself, I can't help you.

    How is Nate supposed to help this team more than Hinrich? He didn't last year, that's for sure.

  • In reply to Don Ellis:

    But Nate was the man late in games, right?

    WRONG.

    In the clutch last season, he jacked up 27.2 shots per 48 minutes, shooting .304 from the field with a .339 eFG%.

    SMOKIN'!!!!!

    At least Nate was money from the FT line in the clutch, that 60.9% shows what a clutch player he is.

    I would point out that the offense was also better in the clutch with Kirk instead of Nate, and that the defense was (obviously) much, much better, but I don't want to seem like I'm piling on.

  • In reply to Don Ellis:

    Hey genius, do you know that there is no statistically significant difference between 106.2 AND 105.9, thats .28 of one percent.

    Nevermind the fact that Hinrich played with our HOF starters featuring 2 allstars and another guy who "should have been" and allstar, while Nate ran with the second string.

    Nate and Hinrich are completely different players, and different teams have different needs in their role players at different times. What we clearly don't have now is a guy like Nate. What we clearly need now is a guy like Nate, if not Nate, an irrational confidence guy, you know the guy who doesn't swallow his dick everytime he has an open 3 to win the game. and I'm not knocking Hinrich, I'm looking for someone better than Teague, so get your argument straight.

    Heaven forbid, someone should dislike Teague, who looks about as intelligent as you act and sound, just because you want to go Skip Bayless on us and prove how smart you are by liking Teague.

    Teague will never be half the player that either Hinrich or Nate are in the NBA. I only wish there were a bet that we could make, that would make it worth my while to come to Paducahville and collect.

    I am starting to believe that you don't even watch the games, you just watch the stats, its the only way that you can make yourself feel smart since you can't figure anything out for yourself.

    So get your head and your stats out of your ass and wake up to the real world and stop being such a raging jackass all day everyday.

  • In reply to BigWay:

    I'm just going to embarass the hell out of out one last time tonight, I have some work to do.

    It had ZERO to do with "the fact that Hinrich played with our HOF starters featuring 2 allstars and another guy who "should have been" and allstar, while Nate ran with the second string."

    LMMFAO, you know, it's easy enough to look at Kirk and Nate with the same 4 teammates on the floor. There is actual evidence as to who played better with the All-Stars.

    Each of them played over 200 minutes with Deng, Boozer and Noah:

    Kirk-Hamilton-Deng-Boozer-Noah 428 min, 1.03 off, 1.00 def, +28
    Nate-Hamilton-Deng-Boozer-Noah 218 min, 0.93 off, 1.07 def, -47

    Kirk-Belinelli-Deng-Boozer-Noah 296 min, 0.98 off, 1.02 def, -22
    Nate-Belinelli-Deng-Boozer-Noah 236 min, 0.97 off, 1.08 def, -35

    Even playing with "our HOF starters featuring 2 allstars and another guy who "should have been" and (sic) allstar", the TEAM was better with Kirk on the floor instead of Nate.

    Now, do you have any other stupid opinions that I can prove to be factually 100% incorrect, or can I get some work done now?

  • Teague is terrible, in 11 games Snell already showed more than Teague did in almost 1.5 seasons. I can get the "let Teague be our tank commander" argument but I don't know about the development one. He seems so far away right now that the best we can hope for is that some GM would just take a flyer on him for a 2nd round pick because he's young.

    Like Mark Deeks said a couple of months ago, his problem isn't that he's having trouble translating his skills to the NBA game but rather him not having a whole lot of skills to begin with. Right now he can give you some mediocre defense and that's about it. Offensively, I have yet to see anything that I wouldn't see from an average american combo guard in the Italian league, probably even less. Teague has gotten plenty of chances and he looked pretty bad, at this point there's no more reason to develop Teague than it is to develop Erik Murphy and Murphy might not even be in the NBA come next season.

  • In reply to FibGld05:

    Mark Deeks knows very little about actual NBA game play, he's one of the best Salary Cap guys on the planet but that's it. Don't put much stock into anything he writes.

    Teague has played less than 500 NBA minutes, he is still more raw than lots and lots of rookies. He's still the 13th youngest player in the NBA.

    Teague shot .325 on 3's as a college freshman.
    Butler shot .000
    Snell shot .345
    MDJ only shot .351, and he's now one of the best 3-pt shooters in the NBA.

    Of course, it makes a lot of sense to judge Teague on the TWO 3's he has attempted so far this season.

    His brother Jeff's first year in the league- when he was 21, older than Teague is now- he shot .396 overall and .219 from behind the arc in 719 minutes- more minutes than Marquis has played so far in his career. At age 25, Jeff is putting up 17/8 in 33 minutes.

    I'm glad everyone is writing Marquis off, though- it's just gonna make me look that much better when he turns into an actual NBA player.

  • In reply to Don Ellis:

    I have no dog in this hunt,

    but it is obvious from your comments over the past couple of days that Deeks must have had the temerity to disagree with you about something. I.E he doesn't like Teague, and didn't like him from day one, like many of the rest of us here, and many of us who have been about 99% right on the Bulls draft picks over the past decade or so.

    Isn't Deeks the guy that Doug turns his site over to to evaluate the Bulls prospective draft picks each year. If so, then you apparently think that Doug is a moron too for turning his site over to a guy who knows nothing about how the game of basketball is played, after all he is just a bean counter like Irwin Mandel.

    So now, not only are you the expert on everything Bulls/basketball, but you are apparently the expert on everyone else on the planets ability to comment knowledgeably on the game of basketball.

    You really need to get over yourself, your Napolean complex is as big as Russia, and we all know what happened to him when he went there. Well, maybe not all, since one can't be the worlds greatest authority on everything, although, I am pretty sure that you think that you are.

  • In reply to BigWay:

    No, Deeks didn't disagree with me about anything- he disagreed with the TRUTH and the simple FACTS when he wrote a BS story last year titled "Bulls might waive Nate Robinson to save money (and possibly for another reason, one for which I have no evidence)"

    http://www.shamsports.com/2012/12/bulls-might-waive-nate-robinson-to-save.html

    I actually explained it in detail, but I'm sure you ignored it-well here it is again.

    Deeks is one of the most informed Salary Cap experts out there (as I also pointed out in the last few days), I still use shamsports.com several times a week.

    But I lost all respect for him after that article- because as he actually admits in paragraph 4 that the Bulls would actually save very little by cutting Nate, because they would have been required by the CBA to sign a player to replace him within 2 weeks.

    "The move, then, would be financial. In a best-case scenario for them, cutting Nate on New Year's Eve will save the Bulls about $900,000 after tax calculations, if they are not able to get under the luxury tax threshold by season's end. However, in light of the concurrent rumblings about the desire to move Rip Hamilton, which wasn't difficult to predict, they likely will do so, therefore they'll only be saving about $450,000 on Nate, an even smaller amount. It's also an amount that much of which would more than likely have to be spent again anyway. Chicago only has 13 players on the roster on the moment, and although the NBA allows for 12 for two weeks at a time, 13 is the mandated minimum roster size. Someone will have to be signed - or a succession of people on 10 day contracts - to meet that requirement. And that would demand spending the saved money again. In short, then, the Bulls should suck it up and pay."

    I have no respect for someone who writes a headline saying "the Bulls might cut Nate to save money" when the actual facts are that they would have had to sign someone else to take Nate's place- and since Nate was making the minimum, it wouldn't have saved the Bulls a penny. Hell, his own freaking article says that they would have to "spend(ing) the saved money again".

    Of course, it's also funny that he said Robinson was outplaying Hinrich on a nightly basis, and that's why the Bulls were going to cut him, because he was making Hinrich look bad- even though the FACTS show that the team's offense AND defense were both better when Kirk was playing PG instead of Nate.

    That's a FO-hater conspiracy du jour right there, the Bulls love Hinrich so much that they'd cut the better player so Kirk doesn't look bad. The only problem is, the TEAM was better with Kirk at PG, which FO-haters ignore, but the coach didn't.

    But he did this just to make the Bulls front office look bad- I don't have a problem with anyone using FACTS to make the FO look bad, hell people should criticize the front office if there is an actual, factual reason to do so.

    But we all know your motives, I just showed that Nate didn't help this team very much next year, so you move in with the personal attacks. You must be pissed to know that the offense ran better with Hinrich than Nate last year, very pissed indeed.

    It's funny, I hope I'm not the only one getting a good laugh out of it.

  • In reply to Don Ellis:

    Yes, you are the only one getting even a little chuckle out of this. Since to begin with nobody is talking about Hinrich vs Nate, the conversation has been about what we might do to supplement Hinrich with someone better than that useless mope a dope Teague.

    But why let reality get in the way of another rage induced hateful off topic rant. But since you somehow turned that into a personal vendetta on Marks Deeks integrity, lets address that issue. and yes, I didn't bother to read that irrelevant pile of drivel on whatever life altering faux paux you think that Deeks made.

    Regardless of the validity of your beef with Deeks, even if you are totally correct, which is almost certainly not the case, it seems like an incredibly small issue that only an incredibly small man would feel the need to go completely berserk over and go after someone so viscously for. An issue which still wouldn't have any bearing on his ability to evaluate basketball talent as it translates to the NBA, an issue in a completely different realm than your life or death beef with Deeks integrity. So as usual, you put one and one together and got 13.2. I guess thats just the magic of keeping your head buried in the stat filled computer that you keep buried deep in your rectum.

    However, if you feel that strongly about this issue as it relates to Deeks integrity then you really need to call the Paducahville suicide hotline immediately, because how can you possibly bear the weight of reading the shit that you write, especially the headlines, starting with, of course, "the site for intelligent Bulls fans" or whatever it is that you call your homage to your own genius.

    Oh, thats right, arrogant delusional hypocrisy is always blissfully ignorant in its lack of self awareness.

    I have no idea where all this irrational hatred and anger comes from, but could it be that you are the abandoned bastard child of NY Times writers Maureen Dowd and Paul Krugman, if so call then you really do need to call the Paducahville suicide hotline immediately. I'd give you the number, but its really not worth the boozer like effort.

  • In reply to Don Ellis:

    Jeff Teague improved his play every year and even though he started off bad, he was still miles better than Marquis is. Jeff had a weak rookie campaign but he still managed to finish with 11.4 per and he improved it every season. Marquis right now is on pace to having one of the worst seasons for a player in NBA history with a -8.1 per and he's a second year player.

    I don't really care about how many minutes he played so far. Snell played just 162 minutes and for a significant portion of them looked much better than Marquis ever did. You know what? If Teague was playing poorly but at least showing some raw basketball skill worth developing then I wouldn't mind. But as I've said in my original post - so far he hasn't been able to show anything you wouldn't find in an average american combo guard in Italy. Marquis is a point guard who doesn't know how to run an NBA offense, can't shoot, can't finish around the rim and can't even time the passes to the spotting up shooters right. At this point, his greatest contribution offensively is getting the ball over the half court line and sometimes he can't even do that right. Defensively he's nothing special, not particularly bad but not particularly good also. Being raw is no excuse for the way Marquis has looked so far.

  • Teague probably needs to go to the D-League if the Bulls really did want to try to develop him, he's so far below the NBA level right now that he's not going to develop anything on the Bulls. D-League is probably more his level, I really don't see it as being so easy for him he wouldn't learn anything: after all the D-league is filled with the sorts of guys he didn't exactly light up in college.

    The Bulls definitely need Teague to be their tank commander though, so to hell with trying to develop the 0.1% chance Teague ever becomes a good NBA player, let him flounder out there on the court and get the losses.

    Not tanking would be so disappointing to me, not only for the long term but the short term. If the Bulls are tanking there's a reason to stay interested in the season. Every game matters then. If they're trying to win (but being mediocre at it) it's just boring.

  • Everybody wants the Bulls to tank. However given how weak the East is, I don't think they can possibly lose enough. Of course they can blatantly sit players out, but that would make the league and the team look extremely bad. Everyone has some pride, you cannot ask a player to play poorly and embarrass himself.

  • Instead of trying to put the worst team possible on the court and making the players go through such a career embarrassing season, wouldn't it be simpler to just forfeit the games? Just stop playing all together.
    Seriously, though, the reason I don't want the team to trade everyone is because they really don't need to. The team isn't exactly winning games now anyway, so they may end up in the lottery anyway. If they can get the Bobcats pick to go along with there own, then they can fill the roster with talent. Miritic is coming, two draft picks, and some money to spend in free agency. Should they trade Deng, I don't know. Dwight Howard scared a lot of teams away from rental players last season. If he isn't going to resign with you, why would you give something up for him. Teams that think he can get them a championship might be willing to trade, but what do you get back? Do the Bulls want to trade Deng and get back contracts with multiple years left on them? I doubt it. So Deng could be on the team for the full season. If not then I don't see him being moved until the trade deadline.
    I still think the Bulls are sitting pretty. I see no reason for Rose not to come back fully healthy next year. They could draft a starting SG or get one in free agency ( I really like the idea of Snell and Dunleavey coming in off the bench). Move Butler to SF. Bring in Mirotic with Gibson being a super sub off the bench (does anyone else think he should be getting some talk for Sixth Man award). Keep Noah and draft a backup for him ( I like the 7 footer from Baylor). A team like that could be right back into title contention next year. If you go all in on lottery picks, you start your franchise over, make it very unattractive for big free agents, and put your title hopes four or five years down the road. Plus, you may need a new head coach. Thibs is a B to C guy, not the A to B guy one needs for a rebuilding franchise.

  • Wow, what a vicious fan base! What are these same fans gonna say if Teague makes them eat all of their words--just think about it--all he needs is one good game. Gentleman that is what does youth can do! Give the kid time guys--there's almost no one else available. Lets show wisdom and not disgust!

  • We tend to forget that we were 19 once upon a time--we forget how we thought everybody was. When you guy were his age--do you remember how hard everything was? Do you remember all the hills and valley we wanted to climb? Do you remember how you had to pick yourself up and start over again and again?

  • Do you guys remember how people treated you? Do you remember the mistakes you made? And now look at you, all of you--fools rush in where Angels dare to thread!

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    I don't want that Teague plays in the D-League either. If Bulls tank, this is the perfect tool currently Xp

    It's likely that he will never be a proper nba player, it's not possible to hit always with low picks in the draft. It seems that Snell is a more valuable player at least. But remember that Teague is even younger than him, so we must give him a chance, he can/must improve a lot.

    However, I don't think that Bulls can afford trade Hinrich if they don't get another decent PG, and I doubt this is the case. I'm sorry to disagree with you in that case but I think that Hinrich is a good piece for Bulls in next 2-3 years (if we do pay him less than 2 million a year)

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