Derrick Rose nearing recovery or not?

Rose was seen doing some sprints at the Berto center causing speculation that he might come back soon. You can do a sprint without an ACL, so I wouldn't take much from this. However, Ric Bucher noted Rose has been dunking for months which is more interesting.

Buc's full tweet (spacing added by myself for readability):

Derrick Rose has been dunking for weeks, but let's stop the madness

He's not anywhere close to practicing or playing. There are those in his camp who don't think he should play at all this season, for a couple of reasons: first, and foremost, the Bulls don't have a championship-caliber roster, so why shorten the strength and conditioning period for his knee to drag them into the playoffs or an extra round or two deeper. Second, don't mask just how flawed this roster is by coming back and finishing up strong.

(My second call-out of the week: where are all those trumpeting the last few years how the Bulls' success was more or equally about their defense and Tom Thibodeau's coaching over DRose being a one-man assault weapon? Or that there was more talent around him than some people realized? No offense to Thibodeau, who is a very good coach, but just how brilliant is he looking now? Or the suggestion the Bulls' defense was good in spite, not because, of Derrick?

Defensive FG percentage, overall and from 3pt range, suggest otherwise. And then there's just watching and comparing the actual games, that antiquated means of assessing a team -- I know, I'm a dinosaur that way.) Of course, all of this could be trumped by Rose simply deciding his body feels good enough to return and refusing to wait a minute longer.

That is a very real possibility -- the Bulls could be 11 games out of a playoff spot with 10 to play and Rose would still think he could find a way to lead them there, or kill himself trying. But any suggestions that he could come back before March, from what I'm told, is filling the fan base and everyone else with unrealistic hope that a championship run is still in the equation. This season will be worthwhile if, and only if, it convinces management not to exploit Rose's talent, refusal to complain and never-say-die attitude and accept that what they have around him right now is not enough.

Let me just state the insanity here:
1: Derrick Rose has been dunking for months? Really? Now this is newsworthy because a dunk actually puts a pretty huge amount of stress on your knees to jump and land. I'm going to go ahead and call BS on this one, but if it's legit then I consider it awfully positive news.

2: Why shorten his recovery period to bring him back this year? A better question is why lengthen it past the normal recovery period which would have him ready in January or February? After he's physically ready what he needs most is to get confidence back by playing in games.

3: His family will hold him out to highlight how bad the roster is without him? If he thought Derrick would do this, I'd call it a WTF moment, but NBA families can be crazy, so I'll remain open to the possibility. However, odds of anyone convincing Derrick Rose to sit when he's ready to play, especially to highlight how bad the roster is? Zero.

Besides which, if the roster wins half their games, will we really think it's that bad? Does anyone really believe this group is better than .500 without Derrick Rose on the season? This seems like a pointless gesture.

4: No possibility of a return before March? I'd be very surprised if Derrick Rose doesn't return immediately after the all-star break (or sometime before that). At this point I think a late January return is possible, but if they miss that date by a week or so they'll just hold out until after the all-star break to get in the extra week of rest for free.

Granted, a post-all star break return is close enough to March that Bucher doesn't look like a complete imbecile for saying this, but I'd be surprised if Rose isn't back in February, even if that February timeline is nearing the end of it after the all star game.

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  • I wonder who "in his camp" refers to? This is such a vague statement that I put little stock in the rest of it. Sounds like standard ESPN "journalism".

  • In reply to Hoover:

    Except he's not with ESPN anymore, lol.

    Butcher has always had a relationship with Rose and 'his camp'.

  • The first home game after the All-Star Break is against Miami. The UC would go bananas if D Rose made his debut then, but the 15+ point loss would be kind of a buzzkill. Still, it'll be on TNT. I wonder if Stern would fine the Bulls for holding Rose out if he's healthy?

    If he is indeed ready to go after the ASG, I could see waiting until the three-game homestand that starts Feb 26 against CLE.

  • In reply to Tyler Soze:

    I doubt they could fine the Bulls given his injury situation. Even if he came back early then sat out that game they could claim it was a poor response to his knee.

    It's too easy to say any time he misses is injury related.

  • In reply to Tyler Soze:

    I understand that he's been working out for months now but you know how When you don't work out for a long time and then you work out your body gets sore and ached...

    I could see Rose coming back a couple games before the All-Star break and then let his body rest During the All-Star break and then after the All-Star break will be ready to go.

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    In reply to Tyler Soze:

    15+ point loss? Like the won Miami just handed New York without Carmelo? Oh no, the Knicks handed Miami a 20 point loss.

    Anything can happen and the Bulls have beaten Miami without Rose before. I really wouldn't be so quick to chalk up losses.

  • In terms of an ACL injury, it's more of a problem of the lateral movements like cutting and changing directions. He should be fine to run and jump in one direction.

  • In reply to zachmanisback:

    Agree, but dunking typically involves lateral movement. It's not like jumping straight up and down. It's definitely a higher risk type of jumping.

  • In reply to DougThonus:

    During my ACL rehab, I was doing basic jumping exercises 2 months in, and was able to do some basic jumping kicks at the 6-7 month mark.

    Given Derrick's overall athletic ability, as well as the level of treatment he received probably dwarfed what I had (I was going to 1 hour sessions three times a week to start...he was probably doing at least a few hours each day right out of the gate), I don't think most dunks would be overly problematic for him at this point, and some basic ones (take a step and jump straight up) could have easily been accomplished a couple of months back.

    The ones I'd be concerned about would be ones where he was launching from the injured leg only, or if he was landing on only one leg; like on-the-run alley-oops.

  • In reply to Salvamini:

    Also, think Adrian Peterson. The beating he has been taking since pre-season, where that timeline compares to Derrick's, etc.

    ACL replacements have come a long way. Better techniques + better drugs (less pain & swelling = ability to rehab more) make a lot of difference.

  • Its hard to say it was all Rose the past two seasons when the roster has taken a fairly obvious downturn especially regarding the destruction of the Bench Mob. So saying Thibs was only being propt up by Rose because they are struggling this year without him is a dumb arguement. Not to diminish Rose's Value he is a legit MVP and among the best players in the league.

    Even if Rose comes back this group is nothing more than one and dones. Shut down Rose you shut down the entire offense.

  • In reply to Chad:

    Kirk Hinrich is to the SG position as GarPax is to the GM position.

  • In reply to Chad:

    It starts and ends with Rose.

    With out that MVP superstar, Thibs would just be another Scott Skiles or Doug Collins.

  • In reply to YouBlewwIt:

    They would be doing better this year if they had last years roster was my point. Saying they suck this year and then claiming that D Rose is the only variable is a joke. They gutted the bench which had been the strength of the team IMO and that is hurting them as much as anything. Especially given how much Rose was out or at less than 100% last year.

  • This part is the most ridiclous:

    "Or the suggestion the Bulls' defense was good in spite, not because, of Derrick?

    Defensive FG percentage, overall and from 3pt range, suggest otherwise. And then there's just watching and comparing the actual games, that antiquated means of assessing a team -- I know, I'm a dinosaur that way.)"

    The Bulls are still at the top of the league in defensive efficiency, and that is with losing Asik who had a bigger imapct defensively in 12 minutes per game than Derrick did in 38 minutes. If the belief that Derrick was a key piece to the Bulls defense entered your mind Buc then you shouldn't be protesting about being a dinosaur. I'm pretty sure you're a stegosauras.

  • In reply to scotter:

    I find your argument just as ridiculous.

    Like you said, the Bulls are still at the top of the defensive categories...so if you say since Rose being out shows his little impact, then Asik and Brewer not being on this team shows THEIR little impact as well.

    But as we have seen and know, Asik and Brewer are great defensive players.

  • In reply to scotter:

    I think the Bulls miss Derrick defensively and think he was one of the best PG defenders in the league. That said, perimeter defense isn't nearly so important as interior defense, so his impact isn't as great.

  • In reply to DougThonus:

    Ah but we have the mighty Kirk Hinrich Defensive Ace now! How could we possibly miss Rose's defense?

  • I fault this organization for not putting facilitators around Rose!

    We are being exposed especially by athletic teams!

    We should have gotten players like OJ Mayo, JR Smith, Tyreke Evans. Even older players that could have come cheap and given us a spark like Barabosa, Pietrus, Dampier (or other hardnosed Center). Heck I miss Kurt Thomas alot and that guy is very old but smart! He knows how to manage his fouls and rarely do guys get fouled by him and convert their basket and get 1 free throw!!!

  • In reply to smiley:

    At this point were all just beating a dead horse.

    We just have to look into the future but unfortunately for us the future looks dim.

    The bulls need to shake up this lineup and I hate to move Deng because he's the perfect complement for this team but if it allows us to get out of Boozer's contract I think we have to do it.

  • In reply to YouBlewwIt:

    Not only that but we won't get any return on Deng if we are packaging Boozer. It would be for expiring busters or trade exceptions + stiffs. No way they are ever Amnestying Booz so that or trading picks and Boozer are the only way to get out of yet another bad FA signing by Paxson.

  • its definitely going to suck watching ricky rubio and iman shumpert coming back from acl and ballin in january while we have to wait until march but I undersand they don't want to take any chances with the franchise player. I don't know if the extra month of rest really makes that much of a difference but we'll definitely lose more games because of it and probably get a better draft choice since we badly need a backup center and young shooting guard. Plus we have no idea if Deng reups with a cap friendly 4/40 like wallace got with the nets. The next several years should tell us if the Bulls top brass is serious about winning a championship and having kirk hinrich start at shooting guard next year is unacceptable, he is no more then a 3rd combo guard in a 3 guard rotation.

  • In reply to Defense-Rebound13:

    4/40 might sound cap friendly, but if that's what much Deng got, the Bulls would have about $6mil in cap space...less if we signed Mirotic.

    Assuming the Bulls do in fact Amnesty Boozer in 2014 (I never believed they will, instead probably throw in a pick for someone to take his expiring contract off their hands)...

    Rose - $18.9
    Noah - $12.2
    Taj - $8
    Butler - $2
    Teague - $1.1
    2013 1st - $1
    2014 1st - $1
    =
    $44.2 ($15.8 in cap space assuming $60 salary cap)
    +
    Deng - $10
    Mirotic - $3 (and I'm being optimistic)
    =
    $57.2 ($2.8 in cap space)

    So, this 2014 plan is going to be a super success when we find our second star who's ironing to take us over the top, for $2.8 mil.

    AKA... FAIL

  • In reply to YouBlewwIt:

    The Bulls need to keep assets so getting deng signed to a reasonable contract could help us to trade for a Kevin Love or someone similar down the road.........I prefer the Bulls go the "trade route" instead of the free agency. John Paxson and free agency, I cant think of two more terrifying words in one sentence...STRIKEOUT KING. The Bulls need to get creative and trade for the second star next to Rose, he won't fall on their laps.

  • In reply to YouBlewwIt:

    Which proves one of two things, either we should have matched on Asik, or we will not resign Deng, or maybe we are just bleeping f-ing idiots.

  • Okay, we're not going to win any championships this year, and we're not going to tank and luck into the Next Big Thing. But that doesn't mean that this year is wasted, by no means. Upon Derrick's return, he's not going to single-handedly win every close game - but after this last year, we should have found some new closers, someone to pass the ball to when Derrick is too well defended at the end of close games. And this team is patchwork now (though shooters putting the ball through the hoop a little more often makes everyone look better!); but as soon as Derrick returns, suddenly you have your second unit being run by Kirk, and they should get a lot better at both ends. And we can find out if we have Good Nate or Bad Nate pretty quickly any night! And the ability to have both Kirk and Derrick on the floor at the same time, for short periods, will make it harder for other defensive teams to take Derrick out of the offense at crunch time. I don't know if Rip or Beli are the answer going forward, against the serious contenders in the league; but we could certainly still go deep into this year's playoffs, gain valuable experience for Derrick's teammates to step up and not leave it all on him at crunch time, and build momentum and confidence for next season.

    "Always look on the bright side of life... doo doo... doo doo..." - Monty Python. Hey, it gives me SOME reason to keep watching the games, to see how players develop without Derrick and how many of those skills they'll be able to display after his return.

  • Everyone can talk about what it will take to improve the Bulls for the future, trades,evaluating the players on the Bulls roster in this basically throw away season, and of course the amnesty option when it comes to a certain player, but imo it will ultimately come down to Rose. I really do hope that he's paying close attention to the elite teams in the league this year, I hope he sees how far his team has fallen behind the elite teams and that management has really made the Bulls future merky at best because of incompetent and cheap financial decisions. I hope that he really notices that his Bulls team has to be more athletic and have more scoring options. And I hope that he watched the Knicks against the Heat last night. No it wasn't a good game by the Heat in some sense, but the Knicks really played good team ball with the scoring options that they have on their team while playing acceptable defense without Melo playing in the game. The Knicks are a older team, but they have a mixture of experienced players and athletic players that can score from the perimeter. The Bulls will have an up close look at the Knicks this weekend to see how well they are playing and to see what it will take for the Bulls to improve as far as roster change for the future and again... I really do hope that Rose is paying attention to what's going on around him while he's not with the team and get get in his owners ear... even tho I highly doubt it works, to let them know what he wants and needs to be on a successful Bulls team.

  • INteresting, 25+ comments on the Rose post, 1 comment on the game result post.

    I guess that we know where Bulls fans minds and hearts are this season. I have to admit, I am watching the games, but can barely stay awake while doing so.

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