Bulls Beat #241 - 2012 NBA Draft Preview

Bulls Beat #241 - 2012 NBA Draft Preview

I bring on Jonathan Givony of Draftexpress and Kevin States from Bulls Confidential to break down the 2012 NBA draft.

Bulls Beat #241 - Draft Preview


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  • Boozer in the intro? lol you guys have the most boring voices. KC Johnson sound alike here.

  • Calling Luol Deng,

    "The Golden State Warriors, with four picks in the draft (7, 30, 35, and 52), are believed to be interested in adding a veteran small forward capable of playing defense to their starting lineup, and naturally Iguodala's name has come up. Another lottery team believed to be interested in possibly making a move for Iguodala is the Toronto Raptors, who own the eighth pick in the first round. Philadelphia Inquirer"

    The Lakers have reportedly offered Gasol for Iggy, so lets hope that happens. More opportunities to move Deng.

    If we can't get pick 7 or 8, I would still move Deng for both Houstons picks at 14 & 16, I'd even throw in Watson, in fact, I might prefer that to only getting 7 or 8.

    Then, assuming that Rivers is off the board, I would take 2 of 3 from Wroten, Ross or Harkless, maybe pass on Wroten and hope and pray that he lasts until 29, if he doesn't snag Barton or Plumlee or O'Quinn.

    Do something dramatic, dammit.

  • In reply to BigWay:

    So you think Houston is out shopping for 30 million in old contracts, preferably on injured players and are looking to unload both of their first round picks? Dang, I was hoping we'd get all four of Golden State's picks for Boozer.
    I guess we could make both trades.

  • In reply to sfpaper:

    Read much,

    Deng will make about $13.5 million next year. I made no mention of boozer. Our opportunity to trade boozer dissappeared when the Wiz traded Rashard Lewis and his $23 million contract to the Hornets for Ariza and Okafor.

    and yes, there has been a steady stream of reports that Houston is far from thrilled about having another 2 mid level first round picks. They are indeed open to moving both picks, either for an established veteran to get out of the draft altogether, or to move up into the top 5.

    Next time, do some homework, before posting snarky useless responses. Just another bloviator, who massively overestimates the value of draft picks versus already proven players.

    By the way, I guarantee that they would give us both picks for Asik, as they are desperately seeking size.

  • In reply to BigWay:

    FYI, he is some more evidence, it sounds like Deng is not only aware of the trade possibilities, but not that upset if he goes. This indicates to me that the Bulls may have soured on Deng and poisoned the relationship.

    "But Deng, 27, did acknowledge that he's not dismissing recent reports suggesting the Bulls are willing to trade him for a top pick in Thursday's NBA draft, with speculation mounting that Chicago could send Deng to the Golden State Warriors in exchange for the No. 7 overall pick.

    Former NBA guard Speedy Claxton, now a scout for the Warriors, attended Britain's practice at the Toyota Center on Sunday afternoon".

    and there are rumors that for the right package you could get the 30th pick in addition and a player/contract like Dorell Wright.

    Golden states new ownership is looking to win now, not to bring another 4 rookies, therefore, they are likely to move at least 2 of their picks.

    However, given the absolute lack of certainty of this draft, I might prefer 14 & 16 over the 7th pick and whatever might come with it. After pick 5, there are no sure fire stars, actually after pick #1.

    I find it very interesting how all you guys that have spent years defending Deng's value to the Bulls, then turn around and suggest that no one in their right mind would ever give up a middling draft pick or 2 for him. Make up your minds.

  • In reply to BigWay:

    Now you say that Golden State may give up two first round picks + Dorell Wright for Luol Deng!!! You do realize that would instantly take them from having cap space to way over the limit? They already have four players making 10 mill per year. Throw in Deng, and they are in worse shape than nearly every team in the league. Yes, they want to win now. Yes, they are willing to trade a pick or two. But they won't take Deng's salary without dumping Biedrins or Jefferson. And that stinks for us.

    You always conveniently leave out the part where the Bulls take back a hideous contract.

  • In reply to BigWay:

    Deng has two years remaining for 27.6 million. You were offering CJ Watson as well. That makes 30+ million. It doesn't count as 13.5 million, as much as you'd like to misrepresent it that way.
    The Boozer comment was a joke, because you seem to think teams are wildly rushing forward to dump first round picks for huge contracts. You apparently think they hate to have cap space.
    The only way they get those picks is if they take back similarly awful contracts, and then what is the point?

    And I don't overestimate the value of draft picks. I personally think it is stupid to trade established players for picks, unless you are drastically improving the cap situation.

    And there is no way on this Earth they are dumping two first round picks for Asik. He's a restricted free agent. They are almost certain to make him an offer (or Roy Hibbert). They will not be lowballing either, because there are several other teams interested. They will offer him what they think he is worth. Now I suppose the Bulls could accept and then trade him still, but then the Rockets must pay him what he is worth + two first round picks?! That makes no sense. And you make no sense.

    I haven't posted comments to this blog until this week, but I've loyally been reading it for several years. And in all that time, there are a total of two posters who I feel have made reasonable trade suggestions (as in trades that BOTH sides might consider). Those two are "YouBlewwIt" and Doug.

  • In reply to sfpaper:

    Restricted means the Bulls can match and have indicated that they will match on Asik who can only be offered $5million in each of the first 2 years of the contract. Indy has also indicated that they will match on Hibbert.

    This draft has limited and unproven talent at the true center position, and there is a good chance that all 3 will be gone before the 14th pick. Most "experts" will tell you that the 14 & 16 picks are not enough for an established "allstar" veteran like Deng.

    Houston is desperate for legitimate size and tired of the non impact players that it has been drafting in the middle of the first round. So if you don't think that Asik for 2 middling draft picks makes no sense, then it is obvious why you have been hiding in the closet for several years.

    like many first time commenters, you seem more interested in making yourself feel smart by attacking other people than by simply adding your opinion to the discusion. After all that is all that it is your opinion.

    and again, as I said above, I am mostly commenting on things that I have read from other teams hometown newspaper coverage, while applying it logically to the Bulls situation as I see it.

    If you can't play nice, you might want to go back into the closet for several more years.

  • In reply to BigWay:

    another report specifically addressing Deng to GS.

    "Andre Iguodala. Danny Granger. Rudy Gay. The Warriors have been chasing a small forward for weeks trying to get a hold on an All-Star upgrade at that position. You can recognize what they’re going for. Stephen Curry runs the show. The star small forward anchors the perimeter defense, Andrew Bogut handles the defensive load down low. Makes sense, and it’s a popular approach. So naturally the next name on their list is Luol Deng. From the Contra Costa Times:

    Per the NBA rumor mill, the Chicago Bulls are entertaining giving up Luol Deng to get into the NBA draft lottery. According to sources, Golden State hasn’t talked with Chicago about Deng yet. But Deng is on the Warriors’ short list of veteran small forwards they’d be interested in.

    Chicago would have to take some of the Warriors’ baggage in return, such as Richard Jefferson or Andris Biedrins, along with the No. 7 pick. The Bulls may get better offers. Trade talks, from the Warriors end, have been fairly slow. But things won’t pick up in earnest anyway until next week, as the June 28 draft nears.
    via Warriors Notes: Could Deng or Dion Be Fits for the Warriors? – Inside the Warriors – with Marcus Thompson.

    That last part is significant. The Bulls are up against the luxury tax, which owner Jerry Reinsdorf abhors terribly. He’ll avoid it at all costs. And if the Bulls are going into the tax, they’re going into the tax for Omer Asik. Even for a lottery pick at No.7, they are unlikely to surrender an All-Star and take on Andris Biedrins contract. They’ve already got to cover up Carlos Boozer‘s weaknesses on a big contract. Jefferson’s not a bad fit but that’s still quite a drop down."

    The Bulls will try and get into the luxury tax cheap, teams will try and get Deng cheap, and neither are likely to happen unless something funky goes down."

  • In reply to BigWay:

    @BigWay & sfpaper

    Bulls aren't trading Deng to GSW for their 7th pick because GSW is over the cap...meaning they would HAVE to send back 'matching salary'. Wright's $5mil is not enough. It would have to be Biedrins or RJeff and the Bulls aren't doing that.

    When you trade players, you don't don't need to account for their TOTAL remaining money on their contract. Salaries only have to match up in accordance to the year they're being traded in. So for instance, if Deng is being traded tomorrow, the trade partner would have to find salary that's about 125% in proximity of Deng's $13mil salary...not $30mil.

    HOU has no need for Deng. They have Parsons, who they love..and is has about 4 years left at less than $1mil per year. They also have Budinger making less than a million.

    HOU would want Asik though. My guess is they would give us both picks if the Bulls gave them Asik and our 29th pick. But according to Marc Stein and Chad Ford, it looks like HOU is looking to move up in the draft by trading both their picks and Lowry, so they can get TWO top-10 they can get a package together to trade for Dwight (even if he doesn't resign).

    The only viable option the Bulls have is for TOR's 8th+Calderon or Bayless. First, because TOR is under the salary cap, they don't need to send back 'matching salary'. But Bulls need a backup PG while Rose is out, so they can chose the $10mil Calderon who's contract expires after 1 year, or go after the younger Bayless who's a RFA and will get a payraise the Bulls would have to match if they want to keep him.

  • I wish you guys would've talked about that international prospect Evan Fournier. He's supposed to be available around that 20-35 range. He plays like a Ginobili.

  • Even tho the Bulls need to trade for a high lottery pick, its not in their character to do something like that. Trading Deng would be the best move for the team to make cause as I have mentioned before, Deng is a one dementional player that can't create or dribble. He's a descent defender and rebounded but as a third option on a team that depends on him to score in crucial situations his time with the Bulls imo has come and gone. Bulls need play makers besides Rose, anyone that knows the game of basketball and has watched this Bulls team should be able to do this. If I were picking for the Bulls and they did make the trade for the high lottery pick, Beal or Rivers would be the first selection and a player that could replace some of what Deng brought to the Bulls would be at the 29 pick. But like I said before... Bulls management and owner always have been too conservative so why should anyone think or feel any different about them this year. Miami out witted the Bulls 2 years ago and will continue to do so over the next 3or 4 years because of the Bulls unwilling to try something extreme and different.

  • In reply to Reese1:

    Its not in their character to trade for a high lottery pick because they haven't had good enough players to get those high lottery picks.

    Their CHARACTER is to shed salary so Reinsdorf can save money, which is why Deng will be traded...but it won't be for a #2 pick...high enough to get Beal because WAS at #3 will draft him.

    Waiters, Lamb, and Rivers are projected to go somewhere around #8-13, so the Bulls just need to trade up to there.

  • Not that it means much, but glad to hear Jonathon mention the Bulls interest in Barton. That guy really seems to need a personality transplant(Giavony not Barton).

    He is my first choice among those regarded to be available at 29, if Wroten doesn't fall. However, in the last week Barton has started to show up in the 20's in some mock drafts. Unfortunately, he is among the "risers" among the bubble guys.

    You guys addressed it a bit, but the reason that there are some many teams thinking about moving their draft picks, is that it is becoming more and more obvious that this draft is highly overated.

    In the past week, both Larry Bird and Danny Ainge have been quoted as saying that this draft is nothing special, and over hyped.

  • One of the reason's that I like a Houston deal better than a deal for picks 5,7 or 8 is exactly what Kevin States pointed out. Barring any trades, I think that Robinson, Beal and Barnes go 2,3 and 4 in that order. Meaning that MKG is the pick at 5, since the Bulls have no need for Kwame Curry Drummond.

    MKG might be a great team defense guy, a glue guy like Deng himself, but he is a 6'5.75" small forward with no offensive game who will likely end up as a shooting guard in the NBA.

    There would be no obvious best pick if the Bulls acquire the 5,7 or 8 picks(Lamb, Waiters, Lillard or my choice Austin Rivers). If you could get Harkless and Wroten(or Terrance Ross) at 14 & 16 you would be getting 2 of the youngest, most athletic, highest upside guys in the draft, guys that might have been top 5 picks if they stayed in college for more than one year.

    At this point, I'll be happy if the Bulls make any of these moves involving Deng just because I have never been a Deng fan and it is just time for the Bulls to move on from the idea of Deng being part of any "core".

    Oh well, only 4 more days until dissappointment day.

  • In reply to BigWay:

    I agree that there may be better fits for the Bulls in the teens and 20's than higher up. I've read that they are after Lamb, which does nothing for me. I hope they find a way to get Harkless, especially if they can come back later and get a pure shooter like Jenkins.

    I'm intrigued with the potential of Wroten, but I don't see how he fits on the Bulls. I watched him brick 25 straight from the 3 point line at the combine. He never made one. And it looks like he shot 16% from three and 58% at the free throw line in college. Lots of observers at the combine said "his shot is broken", and "someone has to fix that shot". He does follow through at a 45 degree angle to the left. Maybe someone needs to fix his vision.

  • In reply to sfpaper:

    While Wroten does indeed have a broken shot according to reports, he has also been compared to Rondo coming out of college, and his upside is reported to be as high as Gary Payton. He has legitimate size and length 6'4.75 to play both positions and he is only 19 so he has a lot of room to develop.

    I would consider him a steal for a Bulls team looking to rebuild a contender on the fly.

    The Bulls are going to need 2 full time guards to pair with Rose, one should be a classic shooting 2 guard like Ross, and the other has to be a combo guard who can play the point, penetrate, breakdown defenses off the dribble and get to the rim at will, and it would be great if they could both play defense.

    Wroten does all of those things well, and is physical for his position, we can only keep our fingers crossed that he can learn to shoot as a pro. Austin Rivers would be my other pick for that combo guard role, but he is very likely to be gone before 14.

    Obviously, if we trade Deng we are going to need a replacement for him, Harkless has as much upside as anyone in this draft, and may end up being a high riser into the lottery, but is currently projected to be available in the 14-16 range.

    My hope for this draft is that in the aftermath of Rose's injury the Bulls are jolted into action and go for the boldest moves possible. This is the year to divest of older assests that simply haven't paid the desired dividends and attempt to acquire several newer(cheaper) assets.

  • In reply to BigWay:

    HOU really has no need for Deng.

    Parsons and Budinger make a combine $1.8mil per year.

    Plus new reports are HOU wants two top-10 picks so they can package for Dwight.

    But like you, at this point, I just want the Bulls to make a move to shake things up. The Bulls as comprised aren't a match for the Heat, especially now that Lebron has turned into the player he has.

    We need to take some risks on potential guys.

  • Just give me a player who can dribble without looking at his feet and make two of two free throws now and then.

  • In reply to souleater7:

    I'm available.

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