Derrick Rose is one of four untradeable players in the NBA

We often use the term "untradeable" to describe players.   However, the term untradeable really means "would not be traded for any reasonable offer".   However, there are four players in the NBA who would not be traded for any offer.


Derrick Rose

The Chicago native is just 22 and already an MVP.   He's a superstar playing in his home town, and the city would absolutely revolt if he was traded for anyone.  LeBron James?  Kevin Durant?  Dwight Howard?  

You could make a case for any of those three being better than Rose, but none by enough to make up for the love the city has for Rose.  Howard/LeBron are in far worse contractual positions from a team perspective while Durant's one year further along in his deal.

Personally, if we traded Rose for LeBron, I'd cancel my season tickets and probably stop watching basketball.  

Kevin Durant

Oklahoma City's situation with Kevin Durant is similar to Chicago's with Rose.   You could argue Rose, LeBron, or Howard are better, but Oklahoma City has an attachment to Durant that they don't have to those other guys.

He's also got a much better contract situation than Howard/LeBron which is incredibly important for a small market city.  If they continue to build the team, it's also likely Durant will stay while many other stars likely wouldn't.

LeBron James

It may sound crazy due to the ridiculous crap that ESPN floated about how the Heat should trade him which gives some people the thought that there is some sanity in that plan.  However, LeBron is just 26 and the most talented basketball player in the world.

He's also locked up for a good length of time on a deal which is quite reasonable for a superstar.   You simply can't trade him for anything, because he gives your franchise 8 years of contending for a title if you can keep him for a second contract. 

Dwyane Wade

Wade's a great, great player.  I've thought
he's the best SG in the NBA for a couple of years now [yes Kobe fans, I
said best], but the guy has played a reckless style of basketball
throughout his career, is a big injury threat, overlaps your other star
player a lot in what he brings to the table, and is 29 years old.

Ignoring
all human factors, I would trade Wade for any of the three guys listed
above, but the Heat couldn't afford to lose the human factors.

Dwyane
Wade is the reason the Heat have the big three, and to trade him, even
for Howard who would almost certainly improve the team in both the short
and long term relative to Wade, would be a move that would forever doom
the Heat's reputation.

Given the big three came together as
friends, trading any of them would be a massive chemistry blow to the
team, but trading the one who made it all work for your city would be
the biggest back stabbing move imaginable. 

Not on the list, but interesting to talk about

Dwight Howard

Well heck, there are tons of rumors about the Magic trading him, and even though they deny those rumors, it's only because the return stinks relative to the guy they're giving up.

If they could get back one of the above mentioned guys [perhaps other than Wade, but probably him too], they'd pack Howards bags, make a sigh of relief, and prepare to rebuild the team around their new franchise guy.

If Howard were locked in for four or five years he'd be on the list for sure though.

Kobe Bryant

I think it's an interesting question right now as to whether the Lakers would trade Kobe or wouldn't.   You've won five rings with the guy, but he's clearly not in the top three or four players in the NBA at this point. 

You're telling me if a LeBron / Kobe swap is on the table that the Lakers could really say no?   Especially given that LeBron's contract is for about half as much per year by the end of Kobe's deal?

I think L.A. loves Kobe, and they made him a deal that says, "We're overpaying you for everything you've already done for us because we want you to be a Laker for life".   Maybe even in the face of a LeBron/Kobe swap they'd stick with that.

However, the Lakers were willing to cut ties with Shaq despite the fact he was the primary guy responsible for three titles.   They were willing to do so to commit to a young superstar in Kobe Bryant, and they were right.   They were willing to do so because they knew the end was near for Shaq and the money was too high.

Well the same is now true of Kobe, so I have to think they're willing to move him if they could get one of the young studs of the league [though obviously, they couldn't].

Blake Griffin

Would the Clippers trade Blake Griffin for one of those young studs above?   I would have to think the answer is yes, but maybe it's not so clear.    For one, you rarely want to trade a superstar interior player for a superstar perimeter one, and Griffin is the most interior player on the list.

Second, Griffin's the newest guy in the league, so he still has 2 years on his rookie deal before he hits restricted free agency.  He's not going to get away from the Clippers whereas LeBron would likely leave as soon as he's above.   Durant/Rose are also unlikely to escape [Durant's deal already locked up, Rose also restricted], but Durant is on an old CBA deal which will almost certainly be worse than the new one.

The cost conscious Clippers would have to think hard about that.

All that said, I still have to think they'd pull the trigger for Derrick Rose or Kevin Durant for Blake Griffin if they were given a choice.   Griffin's a tremendous prospect and might join this group in another year, but then again, he might not.  He might not ever develop the other aspects to his game outside of being a freak athletic dunker, and if not, you're so much better off with Rose and Durant who've proven they can lead their teams to playoff wins.

Anyone else close?

Chris Paul's contract situation means he can leave on his own shortly, and his history of knee injuries would make him readily available for other guys on the list.

Chris Bosh might have the same "we won't trade you" protection that Wade has, but I doubt it.  The city of Miami certainly isn't going to revolt if you trade Bosh for Dwight Howard, and Bosh quickly became the forgotten man with all the joint Wade/Bron pressers.

Carmelo is locked up for a long time, and he's a great player, but their are still likely five or six guys in the NBA that he's easily traded for without blinking.

Final thoughts

It's going to be a long, long off-season, but I'm going to try and get some creative Bulls ideas out there to discuss everyday.

CHICAGO TRIBUNE VIDEO

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  • doug you posted this at 5:46 a.m. You're waking up too early man.

  • In reply to pinkizdead:

    He's probably got it on auto-publish or something.

  • In reply to jamatokwu:

    I wake up at 5am everyday ;)

  • In reply to pinkizdead:

    How about an article on where would the Bulls be today if they drafted Beasley instead of Rose? No one really cares, but I thought about that the other day when everyone was hammering GarPax for always making horrible decisions after passing over Brooks in this draft. No GM is perfect, but I think they've done a decent job. They also didn't screw up the one easy draft decision that had in picking Rose...it would be a totally different team and direction if they picked Beasley like a lot of the "experts" thought they should. It could be an interesting topic this summer if there isn't much else to talk about.

  • In reply to kayak0109:

    Agree. I see a lot of posters whining about Pax missing out on LaMarcus Aldridge, Marc Gasol, Marshon Brooks and a host of other guys. Well, Portland and everybody else thought Oden would be better than Durant. The Bulls could have done that. I heard a lot of talk radio in Chicago where the experts wanted Beasley for that low post scorer and size.

    If C'ship is the goal, then in the last 5/6 years, only two guys look like c'ship type franchise changers...i.e. Durant and Rose. And, the Bulls didn't make a mistake in that.

  • In reply to kayak0109:

    I'd say the only players that are untradeable are Lebron, Rose, and Durant. This is ignoring the human factor (ie why Doug said Wade is untradeable).

    Howard should be on the list if he were locked up, as well as Wade for the Heat fans, etc. But if I were Riley and didn't give a s^!t about the fans, I would trade Wade or Bosh for Howard in an instant. Gives them a better interior player and would complement the other two's games better.

  • In reply to bpmueller:

    I agree that Howard would be on the list if locked up.

    If trading Wade wouldn't be like a 100 year hex on the Heat, I think they'd dump him for Dwight too.

  • In reply to pinkizdead:

    Dirk is also untradeable. Hello Doug! The city of Dallas would never watch a Mavericks game again if they traded the big German.

    Otherwise, you're right, everyone outside of Rose, Durant, LeBron, and Wade are tradeable.

    The best thing that the Lakers could do IS to trade Kobe, as he's going to kill that team. He's going to keep jacking bad shots, freezing out teammates - and all the while see his D deteriorate because of injuries and age. The dude doesn't practice at all because of his knees.

    He's one of the few superstars who really doesn't realize, because of his huge ego and selfish play, that he no longer is a top player. Frankly, neither did Michael, who really didn't help that lousy Wizards team much as his body started to fall apart. Thank God his last two years were not in a Bulls uniform, as he would have tarnished his legacy.

    But all the other superstars - Bird, Magic, Malone, Stockton, Garnett, Allen - kind of saw the end coming and adjusted their game accordingly. Anyone agree?

  • In reply to ethanboldt:

    Mark Cuban gets a call from OKC or Chicago offering Rose or Durant for Dirk and Dirk is gone.

    Yes, he just won the title, yes Dallas loves him. No way in hell is Cuban stupid enough to keep Dirk over getting a new player to run his franchise for a decade plus though.

  • In reply to DougThonus:

    Thank G-d for video games, so we can play these team line-ups without really having to make the trades. Bulls with Dirk in place of Boozer, Boozer coming off the bench, Watson at PG? Bet the charm would wear off quickly in real life without DRose, but as a virtual line-up, it's fun.

  • In reply to pinkizdead:

    I don't quite follow your logic here. Just cause Howard might force his way out of Orlando, that shouldn't keep him off this list. He's still "untradeable" in almost every sense. He's as good, or better, than about every player on that list.

  • In reply to Juiceboxjerry:

    I don't think so. Howard has had two sets of complementary pieces around him and failed to win a c'ship. His skills are a problem at the end of games. Off-course, he is a great talent and a superstar player. But, his impact on the actual game has become bad. We can blame his cast all we want but going out in the first round of playoffs losing to Atlanta in 6 games....that says he is tradeable and there are players who can give you better bang for the buck.

  • In reply to schaumburgfan:

    That's ridiculous. He's the best defensive player in the league, and I'm not sure there's anyone that close. Defense doesn't impact the end of games?

    We had one of the best closers in the league last year, and we still couldn't hang with the Heat in the fourth quarter, even though there were a few very close games (Particularly the worst Bulls game I've ever witnessed, when we blew that lead in Game 5)

    Plus, this "end of game" stuff is getting way overblown. Just by the nature of the the position, Howard isn't always going to be the optimal scoring option on his team. I hardly think you should hold that against him.

    As much as I love D Rose, I'd take Howard over anyone on that list not named Lebron. And even then it's kind of a close call.

  • In reply to Juiceboxjerry:

    Well, he has been in the league for 7 years. And his offense still doesn't have jump-shots or FT shooting which is consistent. Defense is important but you cannot stop the opposing team all the time in the NBA...you need to counter back with some shots.

    You are missing the point. He is a great player but there needs to be constant improvement in his game/team if you have to be considered untradeable. Right now, his team has regressed and as I said you can blame the FO but losing to Atlanta when Jason Collins(not Andrew Bynum or some other HOF type Center) took him out of his game in the First Round. That should never happen to a untradeable player in his prime. That tells a lot about his game.

  • In reply to schaumburgfan:

    I think you're overthinking this one a bit. Howard is gonna win a title one day, probably plural. Why do we have to wait until then to recognize how good he is?

    Also, if you're pointing out every little flaw in Howard's game, and citing those as reasons why he doesn't belong, why are you letting the four guys on the list off the hook so easily?

    All four of those guys have some issues as well. Other than Wade (mostly due to the refs), no one on the list has a ring either. I don't see why Howard should be singled out.

  • In reply to Juiceboxjerry:

    While every player has their shortcomings, Howard's good outweigh the bad... The fact that he made Orlando a good defensive team by his presence alone has to say something... When I think if untradeable, I think it means you won't get equal value, and he is a dominant big in a league with no dominant centers... When most consider Noah the 2nd best center in the league? That should tell you something...

  • In reply to RC360:

    The point is will their teams have a chance to win the title in the next 4/5 years without making unreasonable trades(getting Deron Williams or Chris Paul to Orlando) or him getting traded to another team like the Lakers, Bulls. You can only say that for Rose, Durant and LeBron(even in Cleveland). You can't say that about Howard.

  • In reply to schaumburgfan:

    Who cares about the team? "Untradeable" was just the word used to describe the value of the player.

  • In reply to schaumburgfan:

    Speaking of tradeable, everyone has said that Carlos Boozer as it stands now is untradeable. So nobody under the cap would use a trade exception to take in most of his salary without having to send much back, and essentially take him for free. Then we use the freed up cap space to get Jason Richardson or whatever other scoring wing/SG we can get out hands on.

    Now I'm not saying we should dot his necessarily. But does anyone out there have a large trade exception of $10 Mil or more who is also under the cap such as a Sacramento? I'm not a financial guy so maybe this is impossible. And maybe no one wants Boozer even for free. And maybe it's silly for us to just give him/his salary away. maybe he can play with Noah, and bounce back. But I'm just wondering if it's even possible/feasible. Partly due to the summer of specualtion/hyotheticals/killing time in the wake of the lockout.

  • In reply to MikeKeane:

    I'm not a financial expert but why would you want to trade Boozer? We are not going to get somebody who can be a better rebounder/offensive player than him at the PF position. I see your point of removing his salary and replacing that salary with Jason Richardson. But, honestly is Taj with Richardson good enough to offset on offense when Noah's offense is not there in the first place.

    The only reason I see getting rid of Boozer(realistically) is the high probability of a flex-cap of around 70 mil being set in the new CBA. If the Bulls salaries are now approx 60 mil...and with Rose's salary increase by ~10 mil..then the Bulls cannot increase Asik/Taj's salaries or change the roster without getting rid of one of the high salaried players. But that said, Noah and Boozer's values are not optimal for trades right now. You will be getting less value back. The question is if you want to trade Boozer,do you wait for his value to increase before you trade him. Will it increase or decrease?

  • In reply to schaumburgfan:

    I think you Amnesty Boozer if given the opportunity, his money can be given to Taj and Asik and Taj+Asik>Boozer in my opinion.

  • In reply to nolebron:

    ya i was talking about this the other day....but at the end of the day, i think you keep boozer because if you dont, you have taj gibson starting 82 games. And dont give me wrong, i love taj gibson, but if he was starting 82 games, i wouldnt like him as much. Just doesnt have the scoring in him imo.

  • In reply to nolebron:

    James Jones just opted out of his Heat Contract. Shot 42% from 3 this year.

  • In reply to Csharp:

    He'd be an OK replacement for Korver assuming we use Korver's contract in a deal. Wouldn't want him playing 20 MPG like he was for the Heat though.

  • In reply to schaumburgfan:

    Given your stance on JR and money making moves ahead of basketball decisions, I'm pretty surprised your rationale for not trading Rose for LeBron is "fans might stop watching".

  • In reply to MikeKeane:

    I wouldn't give up on Boozer just yet. He was a beast before he re-injured himself. Give him one more year and if he still sucks then we got to find a way to get rid of him and his contract.

  • In reply to Juiceboxjerry:

    I completely disagree with the assumption that Dwight Howard will win a title. I also don't think its a given that LeBron wins a title.

    So many things must go right to win a ring, and there are many more great players that HAVEN'T won than great players that have won.

    It is ESPN style reporting that asks, 'how many' when the true question is 'will he ever?'

  • In reply to Juiceboxjerry:

    Griffin has to be on the list. Yoy make a good case for him, but ignore the human factor here. Just ask a Clipper fan (if you can find one) how they would feel about such a deal.

  • In reply to schaumburgfan:

    Doug, Howard would be untradeable if his contract situation were better. Also a Lebron for Howard swap would be a fair and interesting swap.

  • In reply to Chicagokid894:

    I stated as much with Howard and his contract situation, but it's not better.

  • In reply to Chicagokid894:

    Maimi an Orlando should make a trade.....Dwight Howard for LeBron James....thats a pretty darn good trade imo lol

  • In reply to Juiceboxjerry:

    http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/214454/Source_Owners_Will_Push_For_$45_Million_Hard_Cap_Once_Lockout_Begins

    This would just be rediclous and way unfair to the players. Non-guranteed would be stupid. And a cap that low would handcuff teams with current contacts unless they role them back, which again would screw players. dunno if they are leaking this to entice the players to accept current deal.. but if they take this stance we probably lose basketball for some time. if thats offer now im more leaning towards players side

  • In reply to bsampso2:

    If the owners do take that hardline stance, what is the player's response? The nuclear option of decertifying the union and filing lawsuit in federal court?

  • In reply to Juiceboxjerry:

    I think that 99% of just about any group of people would trade Wade for Howard in a heartbeat.

    Rose v Howard is a tough call, but I'd bet that all non bulls fans would take Howard over Rose.

    I believe that Bills Simmons(or is it Hollinger) does an annual ranking of players(including their contract) where he ranks them from the most untradable #1 to most tradable. Basically you would never trade any guy for a guy below him on this list. It is always an intersting read.

    My guess is that right now the List would be.

    Lebron, Howard

    then

    Durant, Rose, Griffin

    then

    Wade, Chris Paul, maybe Dirk

  • In reply to BigWay:

    The Bulls would not trade Rose for Howard though. They wouldn't even think about it IMO.

    I agree that in any situation other than the one where Miami is in where they literally owe WAde their franchise, that it'd be ridiculous to not trade Wade for Howard.

  • In reply to DougThonus:

    LeBron for Howard....thats a good trade for both teams

  • In reply to DougThonus:

    Lets say, for the sake of argument, that NO gives up on keeping Paul and would be willing to accept a deal based around Noah, the rights to Mirotic and the Bobcats pick (IMO that sounds about the going rate for a superstar who wants out).

    You're telling me they wouldn't consider doing that deal and then flip Rose for Howard (assuming both are willing to sign extensions with the Bulls)? I think you'd be silly to at least not give it consideration. Even the biggest Rose fan has to admit he's not better than Paul by anywhere near the amount Howard is better than Noah.

  • In reply to DontLetsStart:

    Rose is better than Paul.

    Rose and howard dominate the game in different ways . one rebounds and dominates the paint with strength. and rose dominates the paint with his speed and skills both are unstoppable . it's a coin toss .either way you don't lose.

  • In reply to DontLetsStart:

    I'm curious about something....After the Miami-Dallas series, my impression of Bosh changed for the better. I really disliked him before, but now, I wouldn't mind seeing him on the Bulls. Compared to LeBron and Dwayne, I think Bosh came off as the most professional of the three, especially playing through that nasty eye-poke. Am I alone in this thinking? Like I said, just curious.

  • In reply to coachskiles:

    You are not alone. Even, I was impressed by Bosh in the playoffs. He also seemed to show the right kind of emotions and hit many clutch shots. He never seemed to make stupid comments even during the season(Wade..the world is happy that Miami is losing...or LeBron tweeting stupid things).

    But that said, he is probably unattainable without doing a Melo kind of deal where you give up Noah, Boozer and maybe somebody else for him. I think the overwhelming response on the blog will be Miami will not trade him what with Wade's elite basketball life might be for only 2/3 years.

  • In reply to coachskiles:

    I always liked Bosh, better defender than he's given credit for and seems to be a guy who would be happy to play second fiddle on offense (which is why he went to Miami really, didn't want the pressure of being the star). Wish he decided to come to Chicago during the off-season, would have been a great fit on this team.

  • In reply to coachskiles:

    Agree completely about Bosh. I see him in a whole different light now.

  • In reply to Juiceboxjerry:

    +1

  • In reply to Juiceboxjerry:

    But I think Orlando would easily take Durant, Rose, or LeBron for Howard without blinking twice because they know they can't keep him anyway.

    They won't trade him because the offers won't be other franchise players, but if they could get a franchise guy for him, they'd leap at that life preserver.

  • Final thoughts: it's gonna be a long off-season and I ain't got shit to talk about so I'll be making stuff up. Bear with me. Lol

  • In reply to jamatokwu:

    Pretty close ;)

  • I'm sitting here, tripping, because I ain't seeing no backlash against Kobe not being on this "untradeable" list. Look, folks, I realize many of these guys are untradeable due to their ages (well, ages being a crucial factor); however, there is NO WAY in the world I'm giving up Kobe, especially if I have an effective squad in place.

    Now, for some of those other guys who aren't as secure in playoff contentionness (D-Rose, even though Bulls made it far, is one; D-Howard; Chris Paul), then, of course, their owners are gonna wanna keep 'em around to sell tickets, as well as contend LATER. For that point alone, I'm keeping Kobe Bean Bryant on my squad. And, IMO, he is untradeable for, at the very least, three years. That brotha will have you in the playoffs--with a HIGH chance of bringing it home--for enough years to deem him untradeable.

    Shame on y'all for not mentioning him in these discussions.

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