Bulls preparing to go conservative due to new CBA?

Nick Friedell:


It's doubtful the Bulls will make a major move on draft night. The
last thing they want to do is add another high-salaried player because
of the uncertainty of the impending lockout and new collective
bargaining agreement.

The safer bet is the Bulls will decide to make both selections. Yes,
first-round contracts are guaranteed, but the salaries are relatively
cheap and the Bulls need to fill out their bench. At present, the Bulls
roster is fairly set. No matter whom the Bulls select, it will be tough
to crack the rotation next season, especially given that the lockout
will probably last so long that it will knock out all league sanctioned
summer leagues and could wipe out any regular version of summer workouts
and training camp.

The Bulls will be content to draft two players and let them learn Tom Thibodeau's system for a year or two.

I won't be surprised if the Bulls would go conservative on draft day and keep their picks rather than packaging them up with expirings/non-guaranteeds for a high priced player like Andre Iguodala.

There's certainly some merit in that without knowing what is comign down the pipe in terms of the new collective bargaining agreement.   The absolute worst case scenario would be to get locked into a situation where you couldn't keep Derrick Rose because of the new salary cap situation.

However, the odds of that are just so extremely unlikely.   I agree that the owners will take back significant salary from the players in this CBA, but I find it hard to believe the NBA forces existing teams to immediately break up due to the new rule.

I can come up with a million iterations of different CBA ideas which are reasonable and allow teams to continue to have flexibility, work within the current system, and still lower money.   I expect the owners will push for such a solution.

While they do want to trim salaries, they need to trim them across the board not trim them by just removing flexibility to add salary or remove the MLE.   Most of the rich owners are the ones paying heavy amounts of luxury tax anyway, so removing these exceptions isn't really saving the struggling teams much.

In reality, they just need to lower the overall salary cap by 10 million while keeping the same rules and phasing in a luxury tax to make things work out for everyone.

So what do you do if you're the Bulls?   Do you spend with an uncertain financial landscape coming up?   If you do, then you have a good chance of finding the last piece to the championship team with some chance of hurting yourself financially (likely worse case scenario is that there's a lower hard cap and an amnesty clause and the Bulls need to waive a high priced player).

I think it's worth taking the chance, because the odds are, it works out in your favor with the new agreement, but the Bulls have certainly been conservative in the past, and it shouldn't surprise us if they are again.

The potential solution to this problem?

O.J.  Mayo.

He's a player who might be available due to salary reasons from Memphis.  The Grizzlies need to work out an extension with Mayo and Marc Gasol, and they're far more likely to choose Marc Gasol. 

Maybe they extend both, but Memphis isn't a team that can afford to spend a lot in salary, so it's certainly possible they'll have to choose.  Maybe they've already chosen internally.

A deal of Bogans + Pargo + Lucas + cap room + draft picks matches O.J. Mayo without any other players coming back.   Memphis saves themselves some present salary, gets a couple of cheap contracts for the next four seasons, and gets something back for a player they can't afford to extend later.

Chicago gets a player that can come in and start next season at shooting guard.   A player who can create off the dribble, provide secondary ball handling, shoot the ball, and has the athleticism to defend.   Mayo's still on his rookie contract for this season, so if the new CBA puts in a non-phased in hard cap, then Chicago could just let him go and would only be out a couple 1st rounders for giving it a shot.

This is a great hedge for Chicago to bring in potential long term talent (and likely have to pay for if they keep him) while still giving them flexibility to have an out if the new CBA crushes things.

Will Memphis take that offer?   Hard to say.  If they had gone out to the Spurs in round one then the answer would have likely been yes.   With their extended playoff run, they'll be under a lot more pressure to bring everyone back.   We'll see what happens.

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  • Good article...I agree that there will not be a scenario that the Bulls will not be able to sign Rose. That's a lame excuse. So, that means a lot of teams will have to let go of their franchise type players or stars? What might happen is the amount of money Rose can get will come down..
    Also, the Bulls have a great "waivable" contract ....Boozer.

  • In reply to schaumburgfan:

    exactly, bulls have almost no risk factor here... i think i've read a similar headline to this one too many times (probably around the trade deadline for the past 7 years or so).

  • In reply to schaumburgfan:

    They have him for $5.6M next season, it would be great if they would deal him to us but they still have him for one more year on the cheap before he hits RFA (although we don't know what the UFA/RFA rules will be in the next CBA). Even with Gasol's extention and ZBo and Gay, they should still be able to stay below the luxury tax line (assuming a similar line next year) and it's not like an amnesty clause would help them, they don't have any bad contracts. The difference between Mayo and Gasol's extention is that they HAVE to do Gasol's this year because he doesn't have a deal in place for next season.

  • In reply to nolebron:

    They could keep Mayo for one more year for sure, but they'll likely have a better shot of getting some value for him now which is why they may consider it now.

    Between Conley, Young, Allen, and Gay, they've got four plenty of perimeter players, and they may want to see if Xavier Henry can come and give them something as well.

  • In reply to schaumburgfan:

    When I saw this my immediate thought was it could be a smoke screen, if you want to trade your draft picks the best thing you can do is make people think you want to use your draft picks so you don't appear desperate to find a deal.

    That said I think using the draft picks (either as is or bundling them to move up a little) has looked like the most likely scenario for a while because of the uncertainty: not just on the Bulls side but on the other teams. And I'm not really unhappy with that, the guys we're talking about in trade that are actually realistic aren't too great, I'd rather take a punt on some guys in the draft.

  • In reply to DontLetsStart:

    +1 & +1

  • In reply to schaumburgfan:

    Lets just welcome back the Bulls starting 2 guard Keith Bogans. The Bulls won't be sneaking up on teams next year and defense can carry them only so far. I guess Bulls management figured they did enough last summer and the United Center will be sold out anyway so why try to continue to improve the team. The new CBA is just an excuse to cop out not to bring in the players they know they will have to pay. So here's to hoping Rose don't resign when his contract is up and force the Bulls to make some kind of big deal after next season when the Bulls will be eliminated in the second round of the playoffs.

  • In reply to Reese1:

    i figure JR feels pretty sure that he can get 3 rounds of playoff income every year for at least a couple of years, since other than miami all the other east top teams are going backwards. As long as the bulls can stay their ground its a pretty good outcome for him.

  • In reply to ixonflex69:

    He'll be in for it when we are stunned by the Knicks in the 1st round next year.

  • In reply to nolebron:

    MrHappy, is that you?

  • In reply to kayak0109:

    Heck no! I actually just meant that we could potentially be upset by anyone, Knicks were the first ones to come to mind.

  • In reply to nolebron:

    haha, I know...just kidding.

  • In reply to nolebron:

    If the knicks are good enough to beat us next year then we won't see them in round 1.

  • In reply to ixonflex69:

    you know what would make a good article? I noticed that the finals (though i havent watched at all) are getting ridiculous ratings... up 22% from the last time those teams matched up in 2006. I'm betting a lot of it owes to the whole Miami Villain hate thing across the country, evryone wants to see them lose. What if, and I'm not saying I believe this at all but it's fun to discuss, the NBA was actually in on all the Lebron-Wade bullshit to make themselves a villain team that would draw a ton of hate and of course attention (negative-positive makes no difference in the numbers)? NWO anyone?? Even if this is completely false, I'm sure Stern is thrilled with his NWO team and the huge ratings. Consider, as par the difference with the 2006 finals, who the hell would be watching a Miami-Dallas finals if it didn't happen like this? No LA, No Chicago, No NY, No Boston... hardly a dream in the traditional sense.

  • In reply to ixonflex69:

    Of course it's good for the NBA, that was obvious as soon as it happened. Everyone suddenly gained a second team they support: whoever Miami is playing. Why do you think there was no tampering investigation even though it was clear what went down was against the rules? I don't think Stern was in on it, but I'm sure he wasn't upset about it when it happened either.

  • In reply to ixonflex69:

    Imagine a Dallas-Miami finals without LeBron and just Wade, Bosh and Dirk. The ratings would have been probably way down.

    The way these three whine all the time has made it an iffy proposition for any team to beat them anyhow with the refs giving it in after some time to a few calls which totally change the momentum in games.

    Whatever, there seems to be a problem with the referees. There was an event in the last game which happened to be kind of an interference type above the rim with players blocking the view. This 65 year old unathletic referees cannot see that as they are running back with half of the speed of Kurt Thomas.

  • In reply to schaumburgfan:

    they at least should let them use steroids or cocaine to help them out.

  • In reply to ixonflex69:

    I think Joey Crawford has, would explain his frequent roid rage.

  • In reply to schaumburgfan:

    Half the speed of Kurt Thomas...is that like Brad Miller speed?

  • In reply to ixonflex69:

    ...because when you're NWO, you're NWO 4-LIFE, brutha. 'Cuz we're just....too.....sweeeeeeeeeeeeeeeet.

  • In reply to ixonflex69:

    I agree that the Heat as villains is a big driving force for the ratings, but I'm not sure the NBA understands this, as through their hype machine ESPN, they are dead set on trying to paint the Heat as good guys.

    On a smaller note, I do not think the Heat are too sweet.

  • In reply to ixonflex69:

    The guy I'd like the Bulls to for is Evan Turner of the 76ers. Turner has the length (6'7), ball handling skills and ability to create his own shot to play the shooting Guard. He also is a pretty tenacious defender, solid rebounder and excellent passer. He doesn't have the greatest athleticism in the world but he has quickness.

    The biggest problem with Turner is his outside shot. Its not consistent enough and the range isn't there but a shot is something that can be fixed with practice. Range is also something that can be fixed with practice. Turner has everything else that we're looking for except for the shooting, which reports say that he's beeen already working on.

    Turner turned off a lot of 76er fan because he didn't come in and blow up the world. Even the organization and Doug Collins went sour on him. This might be an opportunity to "buy low" and reap the rewards. Turner is a hard worker and he can defeinitely score as he showed in college. He just needs to improve consistency and improve on his shot. But he fits the Bulls and Thibs as a perfect complement to this team and DRose.

    I'm not sure what it would take but I think it would start with Taj Gibson, C.J. Watson and draft picks.

    What do you all think?

  • In reply to ripiceman:

    They are moving Iggy to turnover the reigns to Turner.

    What about Kelenna Azibuke? I know he had a major injury, but what about giving him a try on the cheap, if possible?

  • In reply to skystang06:

    I'd be down for Kelenna Azibliualsfdsdgebuke. Turner is an interesting idea, but I agree, Sixers are looking at him for the future by getting rid of Iggy. Maybe I'm overvaluing Taj but I don't think Turner is worth Taj, CJ, and picks unless someone else is coming back with Turner.

  • In reply to ixonflex69:

    You know what would be even better for the NBA than the big three in Miami?

    Both of them going to Chicago or New York where the same thing would play out in a radically bigger market.

  • In reply to DougThonus:

    if Chicago had Miami's weather, we'd be the biggest attraction in the world.

    But as I always tell people, if Chicago had good weather, then it would suck because everyone would want to live there and it would be LA.

  • In reply to BigWay:

    I think if Miami loses this series, the interest will come down a lot next year plus the other contenders will get more confidence/players to counter them.

  • In reply to Reese1:

    So whats your opinion Doug on the Ellis situation. I would like him without losing any starter but outside of that, I think its a bad idea.

    And the fact that people want to let go of Boozer for Lee seems just dumb. Lee is alot worst defensivly. Watch him in NY. He was an open lay up line.

  • In reply to 1096ballenf:

    Lee is a worse defender than Boozer? Ummmm...no. While no one will ever confuse Lee for a Defensive Player of the Year, to be a worse defender than Boozer you would have to be comatose...or dead...or a combination of both. I would take Zombie David Lee over Carlos Boozer. Boozer has not only been bad, but he's been an embarrassment. I am embarrassed to have Boozer on my team. At least with Lee, you would never question his effort...

  • In reply to evilhoban:

    David Lee is every bit as bad at defending anything that moves and every bit as keen to pad his rebounding stats at the expense of defense as Boozer. The only thing that stops people from seeing them as the same player is that it violates the unwritten law of always likening guys to other guys of the same race. ;)

    Lee is just the greener grass on the other side of the fence.

  • In reply to DontLetsStart:

    does he yell like an ass on every play too??

  • In reply to ixonflex69:

    Noah does the same thing. Thats not valid.

  • In reply to 1096ballenf:

    Wrong. Noah does that out of pure hustle, emotion and effort (three things I don't think Boozer has even heard of). That doesn't compare to Boozer's stupid head wag and yelling "And 1" after every lay-up that was created by someone else.

  • In reply to 1096ballenf:

    Great article,

    I would like the Bulls to go after Mayo. Maybe they can package the 28th and 30th picks to move up the draft and trade that pick to Memphis in order to get Mayo. Right now, trading for Mayo makes the most sense.

  • In reply to 1096ballenf:

    Noah is not even in the same universe of assiness as Boozer.

    Noah usually does it when something good has happened, Bozo just does it to act like he is doing something.

  • In reply to ixonflex69:

    Exactly my point. He's the same player...minus the embarassment....AND more likely to accept a role on the bench behind Gibson. What a great bench that could be...

  • In reply to evilhoban:

    I don't know what makes you think Lee is some sort of humble guy who would be happy to accept a bench role. From the unrealistic contract demands he had before he had his breakout season (ie the one year when he actually was the same player as Boozer) he's got a plenty high opinion of himself.

    I wanted Lee ahead of Boozer in the off season, his age and injury history is better, but this year with Golden State he was worse than Boozer was with the Bulls, so it's pretty hard to rag on the Bulls for the decision they made at this point. If Lee bounces back next year and Boozer remains in the funk he was in for the second half of the season then maybe it's valid.

  • In reply to DontLetsStart:

    Didn't say he was humble...I said he would be more likely to accept a bench role then Boozer would. Lee could be tired of losing every year and would sacrifice to be part of a better team. As far as the contract...he's a young guy and that's his first big contract. That was also market value, considering that if Golden State didn't snag him at that price some other team with a shit load of money would have (New Jersey, Minnesota, US if Boozer didn't come).

    ...and what does Lee do on the court that's even half as embarrassing as what Boozer does?

  • In reply to evilhoban:

    I've got no problem with what the GSW paid him, that was after he earned it. I'm talking about earlier, when his contract demands were the reason the Knicks couldn't find any takers for him and had to bring him back on a one year deal. They would have loved to ship him for draft picks, or as the incentive to get Jeffries & Curry off their cap, but nobody wanted to pay what Lee was demanding.

    I just don't see Lee as the sort of guy who will be happy to come off the bench. What I've heard from Knicks fans is that the Knicks tried to get him to play defense (well, as much defense as anyone does on recent Knicks teams) and he ignored the coaches because he thought it would hurt his rebounding stats and hence his contract value. He's very much a me first guy.

    And as far as yelling on the court, I don't give a crap either way. If anything I find Boozer's yelling AND-ONE and GIMME DAT JO amusing.

  • In reply to DontLetsStart:

    It might be amusing when you are delivering, when you are not it is clownlike, assinine, and downright chimpanzee or hyena like.

  • In reply to BigWay:

    What can I say, I like characters, players with personality. My favourite Bulls are Rodman, Artest and Noah.

  • In reply to BigWay:

    That's pretty funny!!

  • In reply to ixonflex69:

    As has been mentioned, the Grizz don't have to do anything with Mayo this offseason. If a team wants mayo, it'll be a seller's market. The Bulls don't like sellers' markets.

    My guess is that "wait and see" (about the CBA) will be the favored strategy by most teams, including the Bulls.

  • In reply to Nossem:

    They don't have to do anything with him, but Mayo's numbers have decreased for three straight seasons, and they have a crowded group of perimeter players.

    The odds of his value being higher while he's a FA next season and hoping of doing a S&T vs him signing somewhere outright after playing another season in this crowded backcourt strike me as long.

    That doesn't mean Memphis trades him, they very well may say "eh, two late firsts and five million in cash ain't that great anyway, who cares if we get nothing later". That would be absolutely valid of them.

    However, they may also decide not to say that.

  • In reply to DougThonus:

    I really don't like what I see of Mayo, I was higher on him before, he has put on weight way to early in his career, and just doesn't look like the kind of athlete that we need at that position.

  • In reply to ixonflex69:

    GIMME THAT SHIT!

  • In reply to ixonflex69:

    No, but Lee does have the Jew-fro to compete with Boozer's not-quite-neck beard in the "well I'm sure he thinks it looks cool" stakes.

  • In reply to DontLetsStart:

    As we all know, Iggy is definitely on the trade block. Now there's rumors of Iggy for Kaman discussions. I don't think Philly would go for this, but it would probably make them think about it for a while and I would be torn as a Chicago fan as well. I think pretty even deal for both sides. Both would get pieces that would help, but both would have to give up young pieces they like.
    http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=3phqbeu

  • In reply to kayak0109:

    Chicago new lineup:
    Rose/Watson
    Meeks/Bogans/Korver
    Iggy/Brewer/Korver
    Boozer/Taj or Taj/Boozer :-)
    Noah/Thomas

    Sixers:
    Holiday/Williams
    Turner/Williams
    Deng/Young
    Brand/Speights/Young
    Hawes/Asik

  • In reply to kayak0109:

    That would be giving up too much. Deng for Iggy would be a lateral move, with Deng being the better all-around player...and I would much rather have Asik than Meeks. It's not a given, but I think Asik has the potential to be an absolute monster....

  • In reply to evilhoban:

    I totally agree with you there, I was just getting creative. I think it could be the better short term play if guys like Mayo, JR, etc. aren't available, but long term, keeping Asik would be better. It'll be a tough call for GarPaxDorf when they start getting more offers for Asik or Taj.

  • In reply to kayak0109:

    Agreed...upgrades may take some thinking out side the box. Let's just hope Boozer doesn't trip over that box and break something....

  • In reply to evilhoban:

    haha...classic!

  • In reply to evilhoban:

    Conservative: The Art of the Deal

    In last year's Boozer acquisition the Bulls had positioned themselves for free agency. They had the money to spend under NBA caps and spent that money.

    Jerry Reinsdorf to my knowledge has never spent a dollar over the luxury tax barrier for the Bulls. I don't mean to say he's cheap, that's not my point.

    Jerry Reinsdorf invests into the White Sox all the time for better players in hopes of improving attendance at the ball park. The U.C. is full all the time. Better, more expensive players will not improve attendance at the UC, it's full.

    So for Jerry Reinsdorf, building a better Chicago Bulls team under the luxury cap, using affordable decisions is the key. If a blockbuster deal is made with draft picks, trades, existing players, the deal will make perfect sense and math.

    So, look for the Bulls to be conservative monetarily. If they perform a creative draft/trade/salary swap action, rest assured the math will be perfect for the ex-IRS agent: Jerry Reinsdorf.

  • In reply to rkraneis:

    TV viewership and general "buzz" around the team is worth something too, if Jerry is that dumb then we are in more trouble than we think.

  • In reply to nolebron:

    Jerry Reinsdorf is an Astute Businessman

    I never would imply that JR is dumb. He's a sports legend in this town, and elsewhere.

    He just lives by different rules, and motivations.

    Reindorf and company did well last year with picking a great coach and assembling a team. Within the constraints set by J. Reinsdorf, they did very well.

    The Chicago Bulls will certainly keep the "buzz" going this off-season. Whether moderate risks are taken with upcoming drafts/trades is unknown.

  • In reply to evilhoban:

    If Mayo can be had at that price, you take it and run. I doubt it will be that easy, even though you are convincing that Memphis might be willing to move on and avoid an extension. My major concern with Mayo, who would help immensely, is that you too have to extend him or cut ties rather quickly. That's great, as you point out, if we get him for spare parts, but not so great if we have to move legit pieces of the current roster to acquire him.

  • In reply to muhammond:

    I think Mayo can be a third guard in the worst case scenario. He is no guarantee to be the best fit as the starting SG along with Rose. But, he is an asset for the future and is young. I would rather have Mayo than Ray Allen, Jamal Crawford, Jason Richardson. We need somebody who can grow with Rose or is young enough to be an asset in a trade. Look at Boozer now...if he was 3 years younger with the same issues, it is a lot better than now.

  • In reply to muhammond:

    I think Mayo is going to demand a much bigger contract than his play deserves, so yeah, if the Bulls are worried about CBA uncertainty and don't want to bring in big contracts, even a guy like Mayo who is on a rookie deal might be an issue.

    I don't think the Bulls can afford to give up their draft picks if they plan on using Mayo as a one year rental. They may not be lottery picks, but they're still assets and the Bulls need all the assets they can get for the eventual consolidation trade.

    IMO if there is legitimate concern over contracts in the new CBA, steer clear of Mayo, because he's the type of player that gets dramatically overpaid in the NBA all the time (mediocre scorers who don't do much else).

  • In reply to evilhoban:

    Is there anyone in the history of the NBA who looks more scary but plays so soft like Boozer?

  • In reply to schaumburgfan:

    Glen Davis is close...

  • In reply to evilhoban:

    Glenn Davis is a rolly-polly fat guy, nowhere near Boozers physique, and he plays with a lot more heart and real effort than Boozer does.

  • In reply to schaumburgfan:

    As I noted early on, Boozer is the phony playground bully, who is really a pussy when confronted. Dennis Rodman would have taken his manhood from him, and made him cry rather than screaming like a chimphyena.

  • In reply to BigWay:

    I don't think he is a bully in any way. If he didn't have an ugly bald head people wouldn't assume it. He's got this perfectly manicured, ridiculous beard, he's thoughtful and fairly soft spoken in interviews, he strikes me as a guy if he wasn't playing basketball he could be a high school science teacher or something.

  • In reply to DontLetsStart:

    Agree...I just talked about how menacing he looks. But that said, from what I have read about his childhood and other things...he seems to be a thoughtful young man.

  • In reply to DontLetsStart:

    Dallas just won, Terry had a great game, some others stepped up too, and of course Dirk. People say you can't win with 1 star, but here Dallas is, on the cusp. They have guys who can step up. We can use that model, and its possible we need just 1 more of those guys.

    Charles Jenkins can be that guy. I see him as a more physical, stronger Jason Terry. An incredibly efficient offensive combo guard. Good at scoring from all over, great passer.

  • In reply to ChiRy:

    It shows we valued defense too much. If Jason Kidd on his 38 year old legs can guard Wade and sometimes LeBron, we can get Monta Ellis to guard them. We definitely need offense. Hopefully, GarPax are as excited as us to see the 3-dbags lose and are getting the right piece and not a defense first SG.

  • In reply to schaumburgfan:

    yup...

  • In reply to schaumburgfan:

    I think all you can take away from it is the Heat are easy to beat when LeBron plays like crap.

  • In reply to DontLetsStart:

    Well, easier I should say ... it's not like Dallas has blown them out.

  • In reply to ChiRy:

    There's a bunch of seniors who can play the two and can shoot and defend that project to be available with our 3 picks ... that's the bonus of using the picks, if we select three of them and let them fight it out in training camp and pre-season hopefully at least one of them works out and can contribute next year.

  • In reply to DontLetsStart:

    And none of them will be shooting guards...

  • In reply to RC360:

    There's no way the Bulls use their three picks without picking a single shooting guard.

  • In reply to DontLetsStart:

    Who though... Charles Jenkins? Travis Leslie? E'Twaun Moore? Shelvin Mack? Nolan Smith? All undersized, and I only see 2 (Mack and Smith) making a difference, and it'll probably be at the point...

  • In reply to RC360:

    Lighty is another guy they'll probably consider. Selby looks to be slipping in the mocks and would be a great risk/reward pick. Brooks will probably go earlier but you never know your luck.

    I don't know exactly who, the Bulls have people who will watch 1000s of hours of these guys, I don't. But there's always guys who go late because of concerns about potential or size or whatever but turn out to be solid players. It's just up to the Bulls to correctly identify them.

    I don't expect to draft someone who starts next year, the Bulls will have to look to free agency for that. But with three picks there should be a decent chance of getting someone who can crack the rotation and maybe work their way to being a starter in year 2 or 3.

  • In reply to DontLetsStart:

    The bulls are really doom this time. The boss (JR) doesn't want to spend $$. The league is now facing a lock out and thus making our summer homework double bummer. The player that we thought could be our 2nd offensive threat turn out to be our biggest weakness. We are really screw up.

  • In reply to evilhoban:

    Doug,

    Whats your thought on Allen Iverson? I think at the very least we could bring him in for an interview. We at least gave T-mac an interview. We are looking for a backup PG. Who better? He can make plays.

    I think he could be a linsey hunter type. He is all passion on the floor and I think he has learned from his past. If he can play like he did for team USA, he would be great for us.

    Thoughts?

  • In reply to 1096ballenf:

    No, no, and definitely not.

  • In reply to KingOfCrumbs:

    I have to agree with King, definitely no. I don't think AI is a Thibs type of player. Despite his statements about being humbled and changed by his time in Europe, I don't see him making any impact at this point in his career.

  • In reply to KingOfCrumbs:

    you forgot hell no and no effing way

  • In reply to 1096ballenf:

    Some people are just not the right fit from a team concept.If you are getting a third piece to propel us to a championship like a Rodman...maybe you do it. But, not as a backup PG for a guy whose body is done, game is done, has no team concept and is old.
    The only positive reason I think we can make use of Iverson is because a lot of people keep saying Rose is a similar player to Iverson and maybe Iverson can teach him some things which Rose should be doing to win more and keep his body intact.

  • In reply to 1096ballenf:

    That suggestion just made me piss blood, it was such a kick in the nuts....

    (I know my name is not "Doug", but I thought I would reply regardless...)

  • In reply to 1096ballenf:

    As we all know JR is not the quickest at getting his wallet out and as an owner is more aware of where the new CBA will be pegged than any fan.

    I think the Bulls will either combine the picks and try to move up to get someone like Marshon Brooks or Iman Shumpert OR sell a pick to the Knicks (JR will pocket the cash) OR draft a SG (or PF see below) at 28 and draft an International and leave him overseas so they don't have to pay him.

    THEN

    with the amnesty clause in the next CBA#
    1. Dump Booz
    2. Pick up Rip for 3mill per

  • In reply to Jersey66:

    At this point it looks like Shumpert would be available at our picks without trading up, although I'd really like Marshon Brooks...

  • In reply to RC360:

    I'd LOVE Marshon Brooks for the Bulls. But he may go in the teens.

  • In reply to Jersey66:

    According to hoopshype.com the Bulls are among several teams interested in Monta Ellis...

  • In reply to 1096ballenf:

    Even if he's learned so much he has a PhD in basketballology now he's still going to be a very undersized player who doesn't have a great jump shot. When he was young and athletic he could compensate for that, but he's 36 years old now.

  • In reply to 1096ballenf:

    I would be willing to listen to Iverson on a minimum contract and give him a tryout if he does well in a scrimmage and interviews well (willing to come off bench, play small minutes etc.. )

    However, I'm not necessarily confident that Iverson's personality is in place or that he's physically still got it. I'm fine taking a look to find out though.

  • In reply to evilhoban:

    Philly doesn't want Deng.

    They want to trade Iggy to free up SF minutes. They're not taking Deng back in a trade.

  • In reply to DougThonus:

    You are correct, that is why we use Deng to get Ellis, and get Iggy by whatever other means necessary.

  • In reply to DougThonus:

    I don't see how they're trying to free up SF minutes. They have a bunch of SG's that they need to free up minutes for not SF's.

  • In reply to evilhoban:

    While I would swap Deng for Iggy, there is no way in hell that I give them Asik too, that is insane. Philly couldn't call the commissioners office fast enough if we offered that deal.

  • In reply to BigWay:

    I agree, I'd hate to give up Asik, but I feel like Asik or Taj is going to have to go to get some help. I personally feel like Taj is more important to keep at this point. I have my doubts that Asik will develop a good offensive game, so I think Taj is the better 2 way player.

    This also isn't my ideal trade, I was just throwing something new out there to create some discussion.

  • In reply to kayak0109:

    I'd hold on to both for 1 more year at least

  • In reply to kayak0109:

    Reinsdorf has spent a lot of money on useless contracts(Ben Wallace, Eddie Robinson, Ron Mercer). The point is not the question of being conservative but getting stuck with the wrong pieces like Dallas with Dampier, LA with Artest, Boston with J'O Neal thinking it is the last piece.
    Whoever they deal/sign hopefully is young enough for the player to grow and we are not worried about him being done in a couple of years like Boozer. Please sign for somebody around 25-26 or less.

  • In reply to schaumburgfan:

    I for one would like to see draft pick compentsation for losing an RFA or a "Franchise" type player in the next CBA. As much as I dislike Cleveland, they should have got a lot more than Miami's late draft picks and a giant trade exception (honestly, what the heck are they going to do with a giant trade exception?). Especially when you can just buy late 1sts for $3M. They should be able to get a pick commensurate with where the player was drafted, this would also prevent teams from having to trade those players for crap.

    For Example, a player coming off of a rookie deal or the 1st extention of the rookie deal can be "tagged" once they are tagged they are locked into a 4 year max deal (to prevent a situation where the Blazers get the #1 pick if Oden leaves) if another team wants to sign that player they lose their #1's for the next two years (if they don't have 1's to give up they lose them as they become available) and the team that lost the franchise player gets a pick commensurate with where the player was drafted.

    With the RFA's you can just do a 1st rounder (next available if the team doesn't have one in the current year). For Example, if ORL didn't match us for Redick, and we signed him we would give them the #30 in this year's draft as compensation..

    Thoughts?

  • In reply to schaumburgfan:

    +1

  • In reply to schaumburgfan:

    Agreed. The good SGs in the league are all old now

  • In reply to schaumburgfan:

    The Bulls could trade Boozer/Deng/Bogans for Lee/Wright/Ellis... I think that's a beneficial trade for both parties, and makes us better...

  • In reply to schaumburgfan:

    That would be Dallas with Brendan Haywood now.

  • In reply to DontLetsStart:

    I would say Lee's younger, healthier, and less likely to decline, plus he's making a bit less money.

    I don't think it's a huge improvement, but I do think we'd be better with Lee.

  • In reply to DougThonus:

    Well that was the reason for signing him originally, but since virtually nobody preferred Lee to Boozer at the time (at least most people seemed to think Lee was just a hustle player when I said he was my second choice behind Bosh), it's a bit rich to turn around and say how much better Lee would be after he regressed even more than Boozer this year.

  • In reply to DougThonus:

    if only we knew that for sure last summer.

  • In reply to evilhoban:

    Thank you, I could not has said it any better.

  • In reply to 1096ballenf:

    I generally agree on Ellis, I like him if we get him for expirings/picks.

    As for Boozer for Lee, I'm not sure that trade does anything one way or the other. Both are bad defenders. Both tend to inflate their rebounding numbers by stealing them from teammates.

    Lee isn't as good a low post player, but might be a bit better defender and probably a better pick and pop player.

    I'd make a swap of Boozer for Lee if I could just because Lee's contract isn't quite as bad, and he's a younger guy less likely to wear down. He's also been healthier throughout his career.

  • In reply to Reese1:

    Free agency starts after the new CBA is determined, so there will be no lack of certainty then. And I'm fairly sure the Bulls can find something in free agency + the draft that can replace Bogans.

    If Rose doesn't sign an extension it would change nothing, he's really going to give up huge amounts of money to play out the qualifying offer? Give me a break, Rose has no power to force the Bulls hand into anything. The rookie scale and restricted free agency system mean young players are the team who drafted them's property for a long time.

  • In reply to Reese1:

    They will make far more money by winning a title.

    Nothing inflates your pocketbooks like winning a championship. The idea that ownership doesn't want to win and doesn't feel urgency because they can sell out the stadium is silly.

    It might mean that they aren't going to do something stupid which gives them a 5% better chance to win next year while decreasing their odds considerably later, but then again, I don't think any fans would want that type of short term thinking either.

  • In reply to schaumburgfan:

    his contract is only waivalble if Reinsdorf is willing to eat the remaining balance, $50-$65 million depending on when the lockout ends. In 1998 when this clause was available team could cut guys without cap consequences, but they had to honor the remaining contracts.

  • In reply to BigWay:

    If he is a good teammate this season, maybe the Bulls have until July 2012 to waive him. Then, they can waive him and sign for a minimum contract with him coming back as the PF of the bench. I think Boozer will go well with Asik rather than Noah for some reason.

  • In reply to schaumburgfan:

    Hey Schaumburgfan, always love your comments! I complete agree here: Asik and Boozer would be a better tag-team because of Asik's outstanding length, kind of like how Chandler helps out Dirk so much on D. Plus, Asik plays great positional D, as Noah is frequently out of position and in the wrong place when Boozer inevitably loses his man.

    And then on O, Boozer can be the man in the post, with Asik there to gobble up the tip-in opportunities.

  • In reply to BigWay:

    We're certainly not eating 60 million on Boozer.

  • In reply to DougThonus:

    Which means we can't dump him under the amnesty clause. It was usually a guy in his last year of a horrible contract, which is why they called it the Allan HOuston clause.

  • In reply to schaumburgfan:

    i would waive six players if i were riensdorf just to keep d rose, first hes the best thing thats happen to the bulls since jordan, this soc alled king james is no more, hes queen james, baby bosh & winer wade, i hope dallas kicks thier butts, oh theres only 1 king & thats stacy king

  • bulls preparing to do nothing? Why the hell not, second round and ECF playoff exits are profitable enough for JR.

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