Take the Bogans challege: How many worse starters in league history can you find?

Found this interesting from realgm's coldfish:

So, a thought went through my mind as I watched the game tonight. Is
Keith Bogans the worst starter ever? I mean, really, like, ever. On
any team. At any time. Ever.

Is he top 10? Top 5?

So,
here is my challenge, find a player who is started 45 or more games for a
team not due to injury who produced less than Bogans.

Here is the bogey
3.6p
2.0r
1.2a
36.7%fg
29.6%3p
6.9PER

So far the thread has turned up Michael Curry and Jason Collins as guys who were worse than Bogans, and I'm sure there are a handful of other guys out there in league history as well, but what makes this so maddening is that there are two very capable players behind him who ALWAYS outproduce him.

If Bogans was delivering on the defensive end that'd be one thing, but he's not.  Bogans probably leads the league in touch fouls that allow three point plays per minute, as he's constantly taking a weak swipe at a guy who has an open shot without stopping the shot, but just handing out the extra point.

He's getting blown by on a regular basis, and he's not hitting open shots.  It's just maddening.  

Can you find more than two worse starters than Bogans?   Remember, it can't be guys who started due to injury, and they must have started for half a season or more.

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  • I wonder why people defend this guy when some fans say he us garbage when it cones to starting and then we get threads like thus one. No offebse Doug but make your mind up about thus guy cause in all reality, he is no good as a starter. I'm sure he is probably a good guy but as a starter on the Bulls he is useless. I will say this again... there has to be something behind starting Bogans over Brewer or Korver and I still say a trade is coming, what kind of trade for the Bulls... I don't know but something is going to take place soon.

  • In reply to Reese1:

    Again, please excuse my mobile phone typing, no time to proof read.

  • In reply to Reese1:

    Wait... Who is defending Bogans? I think Doug has very clearly made up his mind. Long ago.

  • In reply to johnbegone:

    Trust me, there have been times when some fans and Doug have said that they understand why he is starting when everyone should know Bogans should be at the end if the bench. There is no reason to say that people understand when Brewer could be in the starting line up or even Korver, its just ridiculous.

  • In reply to johnbegone:

    I am at the point that I am almost rooting for the Bulls to lose every game until Del Thibideau is forced to make a change.

    The Bulls were not much fun to watch even while they were winning since Noah left, the mere sight of that cretin, Bogans makes me want to stop watching.

    There are no words for the disgust and revulsion that I feel watching him on the court. At this point I might actually prefer the sight of that sociopath Stephen Jackson.

    Can't Paxdorf just cut him without telling Del Thibideau, or better yet while telling Del Thibideau to go fuck himself instead of the entire team as well as the fans.

  • In reply to johnbegone:

    I love that nickname for Bogans! Keith "Bogey" Bogans

  • In reply to johnbegone:

    Honestly, it's not that hard to understand why Thibs was starting him.
    It made perfect sense to me.
    But that time has past.

  • In reply to johnbegone:

    Its time to start booing Bogey unmercifully during the starting lineups Chicago fans, this is beyond ridiculous.

  • In reply to johnbegone:

    It's "Bilbo" Bogans

  • In reply to JohnGalt:

    I think you're onto something. Bilbo Bogans is using the ring of power to control Thibodeau: "One ring to rule the ball, one ring to sign him, one ring to make the call, and in the lineup bind him."

  • In reply to johnbegone:

    i.m a big fan of thibs but i have to say he's late's decisions have been horrible. so he better start coaching or he be out a job!

  • All I can say Doug is if I had a team and was the coach and I knew one certain guy was killing this team (Bogans) cause he wasn't contributing on offense and barely on defense and I had another guy on the team(Brewer)that could defend and put some points on the board, more than 3 or 4 that guy would be starting. If Thibs is playing and starting Bogans to include him in a trade then OK I will understand but if it's anything else, it's just ridiculous and it should have stopped a long time ago.

  • In reply to Reese1:

    even for a trade, i wouldn't play bogans because no one would accept to take him after see him playing. lol

  • In reply to Reese1:

    It's so hard to understand why Thibs keep starting bogans that I'm forced to think Bogans is doing a blackmail towards the coach; Maybe bogans has discover something about the coach(per exemple, sexual affair ...) and he is telling Thibs "if u bench me, i will let everybody knows ".

  • In reply to Reese1:

    Primoz Brezec has to be considered although his season was ended early
    He just missed out your deadline by starting 40 times out of 58 (I think he got injured or something)
    Stats 5 pts 3.2 reb .445 percent shooting (for a center)
    15 mpg
    and in 07-08 he started 18 of the 20 games he played in for the bobcats he produced 1.9 points 2.2 reb .39 fg percentange .8 to

  • Don't have to scan the memory too far on that one, Dickie Simpkins started 48 games for 99-00 Bulls. In that season, he posted a lofty 5.5 PER, while shooting 40% from the field and 50% from the line while averaging just over 4.2 points per game. On the same team, Randy Brown started 55 games with a PER of 7.3 (though, I don't if he was starting due to injury). Then of course, there was Trenton Hassell starting on the '02-'03 Bulls team (in front of Jamal Crawford) who in his 53 starts posted a PER of 6.0, while shooting 37% from the field on his way to averaging 4.2 points per night.

    Yes, Bulls fans, we have suffered through pretty lean years to get to this season.

  • In reply to Dionysus:

    Fine, that was easy. Here's a tougher one: Find a team that was considered to be a title contender that started someone as awful as Bogans.

    That leads to the question: Can you seriously talk about the Bulls as title contenders as long as Bogans starts? Precedence would seem to suggest 'No'.

  • In reply to Dionysus:

    http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/PHI/1973.html

    Um, Bogans doesn't crack that starting lineup, and may be out of the rotation altogether. What does that say?

  • I think what really gets to me with Bogans is how often he fails to trouble the scorers. If you take Bogans 9 scoreless games out of 35 it works out to 21 in an 82 game season.

    Only Collins, Curry, Charles Jones and Jim McIlvaine have that many in a season as starters since 86-87. I'm giving McIlvaine and Jones passes because although they didn't score they both at least brought some other skill (shot blocking). So I think Bogans is top three with Curry and Collins. I think you could make an argument putting him ahead of Curry, but Collins started and did nothing to justify it for years so he has to be number 1.

  • korver being used as rip hamilton is another red mark.

  • Keith Bogus. I was going to say that Darko Milicic was a worse starter, but that was just going off of gut instinct. I looked at his stats and found out that when he had 64 starts in 07-08, he was actually better than Keith Bogans (7.2 ppg, 6.1 rpg, .438 fgp, .8 apg) Just for perspective, though they play different positions, DARKO MILICIC WOULD BE AN UPGRADE OVER KEITH BOGANS. I think I just blew my own mind.

  • In reply to FellowTraveler:

    I've read that three times, and I still can't understand it. My mind doesn't want to accept it. Darko Milicic would give you more production as a starter than Keith Bogus. This is a statistical fact. Is Thibs messing playing mind games with us? Is this like a sick joke? Is he trying to set some kind of a awfulness record or something? Is this whole Bulls season just an elaborate episode of Punk'd centered around Keith Bogus?

  • No. A 7th seed doesn't quite cut it as a serious contender to me. I'd say 3rd or 4th seed is a good cutoff.

    However, I'm glad you mentioned the Spurs. How are they doing with largely the same cast, sans Bogans?

    Obviously, he was such an invaluable member of the team, they surely took a step backwards.

    Hopefully, we take that same step backward sooner rather than later. There is not a single logical reason for him to play.

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