Top 10 players for the next five seasons, where's Derrick?

Top 10 players for the next five seasons, where's Derrick?

There are many ways to value players.   How much would this player help you in one year?   How much would this player help you if you were starting from scratch and had to build a team over a number of years?   Do you factor in present contracts when making these choices?   A top 10 player list can look fairly different depending which of those rules you take.

For our purposes, I'm going to go with the pick the best player for the next five seasons disregarding contract and just looking at projected on-court value over that period of time.   The assumption, of course, is that teams will be formed via dispersal draft, so talent will be spread out evenly throughout the league.

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#1.  LeBron James

Sure we all hate James and think he's <insert ranting swearing phrase here>, but let's be honest, if we could get LeBron James right now, are you really saying no?   It'd feel like selling your soul to root for the guy (and note, that I said this when he was projected to come to Chicago), but hoisting up some championship trophies would allow me to get over it.

The gap between James and the second best player is simply mammoth.   He's too athletic for his size and has too much skill for anyone in the NBA to stand a chance on him defensively.   I recently said he's no Jordan, but he's the closest thing in terms of talent that the league has ever seen.  I think he goes down as the second best player of all time when it's all said and done, or at the very least, top five.

#2 Dwight Howard

This is where the arguments start right?   You could go a lot of directions here, but I'm going with Howard because of the lack of physical big men in the NBA.   Howard isn't a goto guy in the clutch, but in a dispersal draft, their will still be talented guards left at pick #59, while the big man crop will be rather pathetic.  

It just strikes me as far easier to build a team around Howard than a star guard or wing.   You can build a team around Howard and role players.   Dump the ball in down low, let Howard draw a double team or dunk on someone, and then let your shooters shoot.   Also, with Howard, you get opposing big men in foul trouble softening the paint every game, and you have the #1 defensive enforcer in the NBA on your side shoring up your interior defense.

Look at Orlando now, they're a top four team in the league, and their second best player is Vince Carter's ghost, Jameer Nelson, or Rashard Lewis.   Those guys are all pretty mediocre.   Heck, in the dispersal draft, all three might be left when you're picking again.

#3 Kevin Durant

There are a couple players I'd take over Durant for next season, but when projecting out five years, it's hard to trust those other guys in terms of staying healthy.   He's led a fairly pedestrian amount of talent to a 50 win season last year.  Durant scores with such high volume and tremendous efficiency that it allows terrible offensive players like Russell "Yeah you heard me he's terrible offensively" Westbrook and Thabo Sefolosha to look like studs with their defensive abilities.

Put an actual good offensive player next to Durant, and his team's offense would be scary good.   There are some tiny nagging concerns about how he got dominated in the playoffs, since, if he played to his usual game, they would have beaten LA, but I'm not going to hold that against him.

#4 Chris Paul
I am going out on a limb and declaring Chris Paul healthy.   That's somewhat of a risk, because he very well may not be healthy.   Maybe his lingering knee problem from last year will weigh down his career, but I don't think there's any reason to assume that.

It seems like everyone forgot that Paul is fricken awesome because he was hurt last season.  Much like Howard, you can add role players around Paul and watch your team blossom anyway.  He doesn't need a second star, and can turn mediocre teammates into above average players.

He's young enough that he'll play out the next five years and still be in his prime at the end of that run which is more than I can say for most of the elite players left.

#5 Dwyane Wade
I think it's often lost in the mix how good Dwyane Wade really is.   He's already better than Kobe Bryant.  Give him Kobe's cast and Wade is hoisting a trophy as well.   We'll see that this year.  For my money, he's the second best player in the NBA right now, but I simply don't trust him to hold up for five years, so he has to fall behind Durant, Paul, and Howard who are all younger.

Despite the injury and wear concerns, the only guys who are close also have concerns with longevity or lack his level of talent.  Wade can dominate opponents with his efficient offense, drawing fouls, scoring points, racking up assists, and more or less doing everything to run your offense.   He single handedly carried the worst team to ever win the championship to victory.  

That sounds like a backhanded complement, but it's not.  He took schlubs like Antoine Walker, Gary Payton's ghost, and past his prime Shaq to the title.

#6 Deron Williams
Too high for D-Will?   I don't think so.  He'll be in his prime for the next five seasons and brings everything to the table you can ask of from your point guard.   Great at running the offense, stretches the floor with his range, very good defensively, great court vision, can attack the basket, etc..   Williams can really do it all and has no weaknesses in his game.

I think Deron might be the most underrated player in the NBA right now, as he's not typically put up there among the elite players while putting up elite performances. 

#7 Kobe Bryant
I was tempted to drop Kobe lower, because he's already shown some decline.   However, can you really project anyone to definitely pass him who's below him in the next three seasons?   Probably not, which means Kobe wins for the majority of the five year period. 

I think Kobe's the most overrated player in the NBA due to an incredible cast that he plays with and probably even in a one season contest would not take him higher than sixth, but the drop off to the guys below him is large enough that despite his age I won't drop him any lower.

#8 Derrick Rose
I waffled with where to put Rose, because amongst all players, with Rose you are really projecting what he can become rather than what he is right now.  I'd put Rose as a top 15 or so player right now, but the leap to the top 10 is fairly big.   He needs to improve shooting and defense, but we've heard good reports in both aspects this off-season.  

Rose started simply dominating the game at the end of last year, and his overall numbers are skewed negatively as he struggled to recover from a leg injury early on that robbed him his athleticism.  His mid range shot is one of the best in the NBA, and he can get open looks at will with his amazing quickness and ability to hit it off the dribble.

#9 Carmelo Anthony
I debated for a long time about whether to put Anthony ahead of or behind Derrick Rose.   In the end, I think Rose is a winner, and I'm less sure about Anthony in that regard.   I could easily flip flop the pair as Anthony is a better player now, but I think I'd rather have an amazing point guard than an amazing small forward as well given how much depth there is at SF relative to PG.

Still, Anthony's young, a stud, a great scorer, versatile, can play off the ball, and can probably fit into almost any team or with any group of players.  If you wanted to beat me up for sticking him at nine rather than eight and call me a homer I wouldn't blame you.

#10 Chris Bosh

Too high for Bosh?   I don't know, look at the alternatives.   Gasol is 30, so you can't trust him for five more seasons.  Brandon Roy has knee issues, Joe Johnson's aging, and pretty  much every other big name player is already going to be over the hill.

Bosh also had tremendous numbers last season, numbers deserving of this spot without looking at the age of his contemporaries, but those numbers didn't translate into wins.  Bosh has a reputation of playing a bit soft.  However, he's really lacked talent around him, so I'm not going to blame Bosh for that.

Also, there's a lack of quality big men in the NBA, so stacking yourself with a great big man at this point seems like a steal.

#11 John Wall
I know, insane right?   Yeah, I'm quite possibly making a huge mistake, but if you were Washington would you really trade John Wall for anyone I haven't named yet?   I don't think so.

He plays a marquee position, there are no big men left who can hold up for five years, and the best player left outside of Wall is probably Brandon Roy.  I'm going to pass on Roy due to his knee issues given that I don't think he'll hold up for five years, and I think Wall will be a superstar within three seasons.

I know it's hard to anoint a guy before playing an NBA game, but if was August 2003 and you picked LeBron James at #11 then people may have laughed, but they'd all have been wrong. 

[edit, in my morning haze I had two sevens, otherwise I wouldn't have made an 11, but what the heck, I'll leave Wall up there.   Also, to the comments about Evans, you're right, I just forgot about him.   I think I'd probably put him ahead of Wall, still behind Bosh.  I could easily make the case for him up to 8 ahead of Rose though, so I acknowledge I might be crazy on that one]

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  • Tyreke Evans? Tony Parker? 11 guys on your list? Not getting a lot of sleep?

  • In reply to bullshooter:

    My thoughts about Evans exactly. I would project him above Wall, though I believe Wall will ultimately pass him. As for Rose, I may be a homer too but I would project him above D-Will. I think your "August 2003" argument for projecting Wall follows suite with Rose as this is right before what SHOULD be his "superstar leap year". D-Will may get only incrementally better and Kobe's already on the decline. I think that it's fairly safe to say that over the next 5 yrs, he will be a better player that both and possibly higher. But as you said, that's projecting where he can be rather than where he is now.

  • john wall? did you watch the tourney last year? wall is good but i've never seen anyone catch a lucky hype wave like that dude.

  • These lists always make for a good debate. Watching the recent Kobe/Lebron scuffle, personally I think Kobe was the better playoff player for a while even though Boston's defense(should have) beat him twice in the Finals. Certainly now with Riley's system defensively, and with Wade and Bosh as teammates emboldening him LeBron should surge ahead while Kobe begins his descent(32 years of age next week).

    I like the D-Rose respect at No.7. Bottom line I hope that is the correct number(or up to 5). It's too bad he's not dominating on the USA team, but he just hasn't done that well in these settings. I still wouldn't be surprised if his game rises in the FIBA worlds, but he's going to have to make it happen by attacking off the ball, or aggresively/wisely firing to the open man as soon as the double team comes. I definitely would avoid having him bring the ball all the way up the court the way the've been doing and walking predictablypassively into doubles.

    It will be interesting to see if Derrick does come into his own as a true superstar(25 ppg and up), and Thib's D forms a winning/upper echeleon team will Boozer rise to the challenge? If he plays with bumps and bruises his rythm(and the team's momentum will surely rise). I could see a situation then where offensively and defensively Boozer rises to Bosh's level or surpasses him head to head in a playoff setting. Which would give the Bulls two top ten players. And how high could Noah reach if he truly breaks out/reaches another level with that anchor/low block dominant defensive presence his body looks like it finally may have reached?

    Come playoff time Miami could have three top ten players or Chicago could have 2.5 and Miami 2.5. Of course Miami's two would still trump are two big time. But the uncertainty remains if only Rose, Boozer, and Joakim can do their part as players on a major rise up he ladder. Call me for these rankings in April.. ?

  • In reply to MarkNorman:

    I think DRose could reach superstar status also if he raises his APG from 6 to 9 and his PPG stays at 21. I say that b/c Cp3 has had similar numbers and is a general consensus superstar. Also, I think it would add to his longevity b/c of how he scores(drives to the cup)

  • In reply to MarkNorman:

    Hey Doug, with Memphis looking to trade Xavier Henry is there a possibility the Bulls could pick him up? Give up James Johnson, and a second rounder? Maybe a future first seeing that our pick should be a low first round pick.

  • In reply to TheRedPlanet:

    redplanet,

    They Memphis managment came out and said they aren't looking to trade him.

    Check Hoopsworld.

  • In reply to MarkNorman:

    I also like Steph Curry's chances at becoming an elite pg in the league. If Ellis gets traded Curry will take off!

  • Good list(although you have 11 players)...and like Bullshooter says I would definitely put Tyreke Evans above Wall and Bosh over the next 5 years. That guy is a BEAST at PG. Much like Rose all he has to do is tighten his D and improve his shot and he will be unstoppable for the next 5 seasons.

  • #1.) Carmelo Anthony (w/ the Bulls)
    #2.) Derrick Rose (w/ the Bulls)
    #3.) Kevin Durant (w/ the Thunder)
    #4.) LeBron James (w/ the Heat)
    #5.) Deron Williams (w/ the Jazz)
    #6.) Chris Paul (w/ the Hornets)
    #7.) Dwight Howard (w/ the Magic)
    #8.) Brandon Roy (w/ the Blazers)
    #9.) Dwyane Wade (w/ the Heat)
    #10.)Kobe Bryant (w/ the Lakers)

    * If the Chicago Bulls trade for Carmelo Anthony, that's how I see it.

    #1.) Kevin Durant (w/ the Thunder)
    #2.) LeBron James (w/ the Heat)
    #3.) Dwyane Wade (w/ the Heat)
    #4.) Dwight Howard (w/ the Magic)
    #5.) Carmelo Anthony (w/ the Nuggets)
    #6.) Deron Williams (w/ the Jazz)
    #7.) Chris Paul (w/ the Hornets)
    #8.) Derrick Rose (w/ the Bulls)
    #9.) Brandon Roy (w/ the Blazers)
    #10.) Kobe Bryant (w/ the Lakers)

    If the Chicago Bulls don't trade for Carmelo Anthony, that's how I see it.

  • In reply to MrHappy:

    That is inexplicable...no matter where they play Lebron is ALWAYS going to be number 1. Melo doesn't stick D...

  • In reply to mdot1986:

    #1Bullsfan,

    I guess you haven't seen Kevin Durant play yet.

    You might want to check him out.

    Also, if Melo wins titles and Finals' MVP's with the Bulls, I'm guessing he's going to the top of the list.

    Titles and winning matters.

  • In reply to MrHappy:

    I have but in the next 5 years Lebron will be better. He's a better all-around player. KD is scorer and rebounder that's it. Lebron isn't slowing down anytime soon either so he is clearly better.

  • In reply to MrHappy:

    And so begins the daily diarrhea, of Mr. Happy's posts.

  • In reply to jpbaker81:

    Jon,

    That's a messy post Jon-boy.

    I speak the truth, not whatever you are spewing.

    Get some pepto for that.

  • In reply to MrHappy:

    I probably should have flipped LBJ and DWADE on my lists.

    I forget that LBJ is a ROBIN now.

  • 1. How are you picking John Wall over Tyreke Evans? Wall might not be the best guard on his current team for all you know in the next 2/3 seasons.
    2. I wouldn't put Kobe in the top 10 for the next 5 years unless you are doing some kind of averaging. His next 2 years will be in top 5 but after that might not be in top 30.
    3. Wade is good but you are giving too much credit for their title. I think Shaq was at the end of his prime that year. He was commanding a lot of attention that helped Wade to drive and get foul calls. Without Shaq, it is debatable that Miami wouldn't have got out of the 2nd round.
    4. I think it is very difficult to grade the PGs but I do generally agree that Williams and Paul will be better than Rose in the next 2/3 years as they will be reaching their prime and Rose will be still developing.
    5. I don't think Chris Bosh belongs in the top 10. He had a pretty good team in Toronto(not comparing to Lakers) but still didn't do anything to get out of the first round. Now, with LBJ and Wade...he is probably an all-star but that's it. His knee has some issues and I would pick Granger, Griffin(although he was injured and plays for the Clippers),Bogut, Horford(over Bosh)...

  • Also, I like Doug's high praise for Durant. I think he's got the humble yet killer competitor attitude that will someday soon put him at the top even over James. I certainly hope so anyway as he seems like one of the few humble/real/cool young guys in the game(who have superstar talent).

  • In reply to MarkNorman:

    Durrant does seem like an easy guy to root for, and his humility is reason #1.

  • Everyone says Rose can't shoot?! Admittedly he doesn't hit a great percentage on his threes (yet) but he can fill it up from 16-20 feet.

  • Doug, what about Rajon Rondo? Maybe he doesn't fit with this format as someone you draft as your centerpiece, but I've seen you comment on Brandon Roy and Tyreke Evans, and I think Rondo at least needs to be in that conversation.

  • Top 10 = 11 players? Howard #2? Melo #9? 4,5, and 6 should not be ranked before 7,8, and 9. You placed three weak wheels (Paul, Wade, and Williams)ahead of three iron men(Kobe, Rose, and Anthony)! #s 4, 5, and 6 are less valuable because they injure easier than #s 7, 8, and 9. Kobe has to rank before Howard no matter how you slice it! Closers are more valuable than liabilities and at the end of the game; Kobe is a closer and Howard is a liability. As for #10 (Bosh), Howard belongs there. Boozer is way more of a closer than Bosh, but injury factors in so lets just go for Gasol or even Noah and scrap Bosh altogether. Say what you will about Noah, but he is a game changer with a very high running motor.

  • In reply to hinton980:

    Noah is definitely not going to be in the top 10(I hope he does). He might become a top 25 player but not top 10.
    Kobe was/is good but Doug is looking at the next 5 years and he will slow down in the next 2/3 years.

  • Agreed on all counts. For Derrick's sake I do think performing well/rising to the challenge he sees in the FIBA worlds would help him as a person/confidence, but that doesn't mean he can't have a major step forward season if it doesn't happen.

  • He's definitely going to have to become more Pippenish looking no question.

  • Dude, you felt proud to be stronger then Kevin Durant? Right now he looks like a UNICEf commercial.

    I'm kidding. I remember when you said you were trying to run/eat healthier, and that's precisely what I'm doing right now. I doubt I could bench 175 either.

  • Doug, Curry at 17.5ppg at 46%, 380 3's on nearly 44% - why not a fan?

  • I sometimes feel the most overrated thing in the NBA is the closer thing about Kobe...hitting clutch shots for the full span of 3/4 mins at the end is a closer and not just taking the last one or two shots.

  • Agreed as a playoff closer yes. Which is what counts. Regular season Kobe's number of clutch shots is amazing. Kind of tells you something about him as an individual when regular season he looks Jordanish at times, but playoffs looks nothing of the sort.

  • 3. I mean Wade got to do his stuff because of the presence of Shaq and I don't want to get into the refs debate. Every final has that. Agree, Wade generally dominated but it was a lucky win...

    5. Bosh had Bargnani, Jermaine O'Neal and lots of promising players. I am not saying they should win even in the second round but atleast win the first round or make a good series like Rose did with Boston. Even Brandon Jennings made a fight of the first series with Atlanta and Deng/Gordon won against Miami. Bosh is good, I would have loved to have him on the Bulls but he is not a top 10/12 player. Maybe in the top 20. His class(2003) teammates in the top 10 have taken their teams to conference finals or finals.

  • This message is related to the last article about Carmelo. I rarely post, but this is one in which I believe all of you missed some very salient points and most of you missed on additional ones. Here goes:

    I will break this down into two groups:
    1) Carmello's chances of leaving Denver
    2) What is he worth, particularly to the Bulls.

    1) His chances of leaving Denver.

    He will only leave Denver if it is in their best interest. Why, you ask, can I say this? Because Denver knows what the league and most of the players know: What LeBron, Wade and Boh did was a wake up call. If this is allowed to continue it will destroy the league. Both the players and the league know this type of action will kill attendance for all but the 3 or 4 elite teams. That means revenue (particularly from sponsers) will decline, thus, so will players salaries.

    How often will people watch their favorite team (take Memphis) if they know they have no chance of effectively competing? Mempis and Charlotte. Now that is a game I would pay to see (not).

    The new collective bargining agreement will deal with this. I expect to see something like an NFL franchise tag applied. So, where would that leave Carmello? That is why he wants a sign and trade now. But Denver is in the driver's seat and knows it. They are acting somewhat like Berr Rabbit asking not to be thrown into the briar patch. If they trade Carmello, it may look like they did it under duress, but it will be on their terms.

    2) What is he worth, particularly to the Bulls.

    Answer: Not all that much.

    He is very self-centered and not a good fit chenistry-wise for the Bulls.

    A few reminders:
    After his rookie year Carmello complained about not getting enough praise and attention.

    I do not believe Derrick wants him any more than he wanted Lebron. Lebron complained and was surprised that Derrick did not even call him, let alone recruit him. Derrick's answer: He could have called me.

    After Tyrus Thomas was traded, Derrick said, no more guys withn their own agendas. Just guys who want to win and play team basketball. Given these commnets from Derrick, who rarely speaks, especially on controversial matter,these commnets give us insight into Roses' mind set.

    Further, take a hard look at Carmello's stats. he is not a good overall shooter and a horrible 3 point shooter.
    Further, he is not known for his defense.

    I am not saying he is a bad player, just not what he appears to be and not the kind of player the Bulls want, given his selfish, self-centered makeup.

  • In reply to bobgoodhart:

    I usually try to keep my replys to regulars I know(and trust). But I think these are some interesting points.

    I agree Carmelo strikes me as a cocky, self-interested type similar to Chris Paul, LeBron, Amare, and Wade. The difference with Wade being he is unqestionably a winner. If Derrick really did not want LeBron etc. because he feels they are cocky, the way they would have proven him wrong is by coming here seeing the winner within he and Noah with the character and yes talented supporting cast Taj included9and adding Thibs).

    The fact that LeBron wouldn't even talk to him/Derrick maybe confirms his thoughts. Or he just was that enamored/"decided" with Wade. As Doug says with their talent you would "grow" to appreciate them/think they were good guys I suppose. But still, this whole group does strike me as prima donnas who will fall short of expectations unless they can form a trio. Even then there's only one Wade and one Lebron talent wise.

    I'd still take a chance on Carmelo if he'd sign here long term. He might be a guy if Derrick grows into his leadership uni like he needs to with Joakim who could cajole this guy into laying it all out on the floor for the team. He's already put up the individual stats. Now it's winning time if he can see it. It's too bad D-Rose hasn't hit his stride as a true superstar and leader among men because that's what needs to happen if we're going to bring another superstar on board, and win championships.

    I'll keep saying you do need a dominant superstar big/Duncan or a superstar scorer who is also a super leader among men to win championships. Boston and Detroit will happen, but they're one shining moment and not multiple titiles.

    Bottom line: Derrick will have to fulfill the rumblings of the experts that he could be a great one by coming into his own as Leader among men. I'd say that is still a huge question mark, but one I think he can answer in the affirmative. But time will tell. And he'll need to break out as a player performance wise regardless so two big challeneges await Mr. Rose. And I'm rooting for him all the way.

  • In reply to bobgoodhart:

    After his rookie year Carmello complained about not getting enough praise and attention.

    IIRC, he was complaining that people were fawning a ton over LBJ and not him. And I thought he had a point--he had a better rookie season than LeBron.

    Now of course, LeBron has gone on to have the much better career, and we all knew that and why people were fawning. But I thought it was legitimate to say, "Hey, guys, rookie of the year over here".

  • In reply to Duke:

    I wouldn't hold anything against these guys until they have 3/5 years in the NBA unless they do illegal things. They are so young and even with all the coaching, it takes time to grow up to understand the real world and their NBA lifespan. What matters is how they behave(just focussed on winning or interested in theatrics) and play during their prime and what kind of players surround them during that time. That's where they will build their legacy.

    We know Carmelo can take it up a notch to the elite level if he wants to do it. Is he ready to do that or does he want to coast on his current success. That's the job a good GM or a scout should be able to do.

  • In reply to Duke:

    wow you doubted rose a so much on your blog its not even funny and now you easily put john wall number 11 as soon as you have the chance too come up with a list..

    its

    lebron
    durant
    dwight
    rose
    wade
    paul
    melo
    deron
    bosh
    evans

    its five years doug kobe might not be top ten

    kobe will be 37 top 10at 37? better than melo,paul and a bunch of players at 37? hes skinny with multiple injuries already..

    if we always say derrick has a chance to be better than paul and wade in 4 -5 years what changes that now? rose will grow more into a star.. hes already on pace to be better than paul and wade now at te same age as them.. i swear ya always change up on derrick.. dwade will be 32.. rose 26 with a team suited to him and now qith a hard wokring defensive guy.. rose jumpshot already is gettin better and he will get more star treatment at going to the line..

    rose in five years will be top 5 you cant give me another player with a case as strong as rose besides the ones ahead of him..

  • In reply to Duke:

    Wait - you're not going to place Rose (or anyone else) higher on the list because that would be "projecting what he can become rather than what he is right now," yet you place Wall in the top 11 players for the next five seasons, a guy who hasn't played a regular season game yet? Give me a break. That doesn't make sense.

  • In reply to Duke:

    Benching 175 pounds lol Come on doug...you gotta do better then that lol

    IMO I think D Rose has the potential to be a top 5 player in the league. Its up to him to get himself there! Lets see what happens!

  • In reply to bobgoodhart:

    In the end, I think Rose is a winner, and I'm less sure about Anthony in that regard.

    This is a cheap shot, but I found that phrase funny, given that Rose hasn't won anything and Melo has.

    (Okay, yeah, college. Still...)

  • From what I have seen of Wall he looks like a combination of Rose and Rondo, which should be scary to the rest of the league.

    Hard to quibble with anything about your list, I might drop Bosh(since he hasn't impacted winning the way say Wade has). To early to call it, but in 3-5 years Cousins could be in Howards class(but in reverse, offense over defense).

  • I assume this article was a response to Fred's ridiculous assertion that Derrick Rose is a better player (or is very likely to be better) than Kevin Durant?

    Doug, why does Fred seem to think Durant is so unathletic? I've always gotten the impression when I watch him play that he's one of the best athletes in the NBA.

  • I understand your concerns about Roy's injuries, but it is hard to put Evans ahead of him right now. 2 years ago a healthy Roy looked almost as dominant as Paul or Williams.

    Also, if I was picking second, I think that I take Durant, but Howard/Durrant isn't the same problem that Oden/Durrant was, there is no loser.

    Finally, if the Bulls acquire Sam Young he vaults into the top 10.

  • In reply to BigWay:

    lol. Yeah that Sam Young sure is something special.

  • In reply to BigWay:

    True he doesnt have the size or wingspan but if his midrange jumper becomes consistent i can see him being Amare Stoudamire with better rebounding which i believe would get him on this list big ifs though

  • I could see him becoming a Pippen like rebounder, which would not suck if he is scoring like Jordan.

  • What if we sent enough cash to pay for JJ.

  • In reply to BigWay:

    Bigway,

    What if we got Sam Young?

    Memphis isn't lookin to trade Xavier Henry.

    Check Hoopsworld.

  • In reply to MrHappy:

    not a 3 point shooter, not a shooting guard, more of an undersized banger at small forward.

    Not a bad player, but a borderline starter at small forward at best is not the Bulls greatest need at this point.

  • Noah, was a franchise player for 2 years, albeit at Florida.

  • too much

  • Unfortunately, my biggest concern with Rose is that he will be injured a lot or badly because of the way that he throws his body around, kind of like Wade in the early years.

    Keeping my fingers crossed on this one.

  • No I don't think he's "the man" either. I see. You just meant not a fan as a franchise player. Sorry, my bad. I will admit I missed on him though as a good draft pick/player.

  • In reply to MarkNorman:

    I think Curry is a great 6th man of the bench...can handle the ball and shoot well too. Maybe he can be a starting PG if others are great such as in Miami, Lakers or in Orlando but not as a replacement for Rose or Deron Williams...

  • I'd agree on Parker. Although if he ended up in NY he might put up some stellar numbers.

  • Doug, I understand your point about MLB but there may be a few things to consider: 1) Not all is well with MLB financially (if we are to believe the owners). 2) Baseball (see Cubs) is a nice summer day experience with your friends/kids. Winning is important, but I am not so sure it is at the same win-need level of the NBA. And to this point,I now (after 24 years in Naperville) live in So. Cal. The Clippers and Lakers play out of the same arena. Clipper tickets are easy to come by. Not the case with the Lakers.

  • In reply to bobgoodhart:

    Doug, I forgot to ask you, how easy will it be for a super team to assemble if there is a franchise tag in the new CBA? Also, one super team will not do the damage of three. If players replicate what the Miamai trio did, it will strip teams of their star player, who is a good portion of their revenue stream. Now, strip a half dozen or dozen teams of their top player, and what do we have? The answer; Not a pretty picture.

  • Well you're right about that. It's more interesting than "do you think Rudy might be more easily obtained now that he's said XYZ."

    You missed the last part of my original post though. Why does Fred not think Durant is athletic. What's your take on it?

  • Doug, I forgot to ask you, how easy will it be for a super team to assemble if there is a franchise tag in the new CBA? Also, one super team will not do the damage of three. If players replicate what the Miamai trio did, it will strip teams of their star player, who is a good portion of their revenue stream. Now, strip a half dozen or dozen teams of their top player, and what do we have? The answer; Not a pretty picture.

  • Doug,

    It's NOT ABSURD at all.

    If Melo comes to the Bulls, they are going to win multiple NBA championships. My guess is he will also be winning some Finals MVP's.

    That my friend will put him at the top of the list.

    And as we saw with Scottie Pippen, Derrick Rose will be #2.

  • Doug,

    That's just a lack of knowledge right there.

    They kid is worth being a fan of. You should watch him play.

  • RPK,

    Not with Kobe getting older and Phil leaving L.A.

  • No, I don't disagree. I just thought it was funny, is all. :)

    Although I will admit that when he was in college and during his early years, I felt Carmelo was a winner. (Not that I have that opinion of that time now, but at that time that's what I felt.)

  • As an aside, Doug's list made me think of this scene:

    High Fidelity - Top 5 Side Ones Track Ones

  • In reply to Duke:

    Okay, you know what ChicagoNow? If you say that the "a" tag is permitted in HTML then you should make it clear that links are NOT permitted with it.

    Anyway, this is what I was trying to link to:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0EJy4zVeCKI&#t=0m33s

  • Is Henry worse than the Spurs SG pick? James Anderson.. If he was worse than him...either Memphis realized it late and that's why they are trying to not get stuck with him if he is bad.

    If we have to give up the Charlotte pick, then it's not worth it. I would say JJ for Henry..(I know Memphis might laugh at us)..But are just potential guys with JJ a little bit of experience. Both are basically trade fillers for the Bulls anyhow..

  • I agree that Gasol can be in the top 10/15 for the next 5 years. He is a young 31 in the sense, Memphis went out early for most of his career, hadn't had any significant injuries. If Kobe can be in the top 5(with so much mileage), Gasol will be there. He was probably their best player in the playoffs last season.

  • When did Kobe Bryant change his name to Lebron James?

    Good lord. If I remember, I cant wait to come here when the Heat get knocked out of the playoffs so you can all admit he's not the next coming.

    So I pose the question, If the Heat do not win the championship this year, will you (Doug) finally admit that he's not better than Kobe?

  • In reply to Dmband:

    If you were starting a team TODAY and you wanted the highest potential for success over the next 5 years you mean to tell me you would pick Kobe over Lebron??

    Example: if you said I had to pick between '98 Jordan or '08 Lebron...I would have to pick Lebron. Think longterm. Kobe now is not who you want to build a team around its Lebron. Right?

  • In reply to Dmband:

    Here's how ChiRy sees it:
    1-Kevin Durant- This is both a ringing endorsement for the young man with a great game & work ethic to match, and a knock on LeBron who looks like a quitter. If Lebron proves me wrong, it would be closer but I almost still would go Durant. When is this kid gonna find the weight room though?

    2-LeBron James-I strongly dislike the guy but he is the most talented in perhaps the history of the NBA. I don't believe he is a winner, but we will see as he is only 25.

    3-Dwight Howard-Athletic & huge, however not developing an offensive game and only slightly improving free throws which makes him a late game liability. Its late in games when championships are won.

    3a-Derrick Rose-Howard wins some because he is one of the only dominant big men in the game, but mostly because I don't want to be too biased. Howard loses because of the knocks I mentioned above. Derrick loses because of the bias, his D, 3 pt shooting, and game winning shooting, all of which he can develope. The 3-4 battle is a tough one.

    5-Chris Paul-Great player, great stats, young, I just want to see him take his team deeper in the playoffs, but I do think some of that is a result of his teammates, who I believe are mostly made by him. Loses cool points because of injuries.

    6-Deron Williams- Very close with CP3, I just don't see the same upside as him, but I put these PG's ahead of the #7 because it is a harder position to fill and they are younger.

    7-Dwayne Wade- An asshat for sure, but I agree that he is top 3 player on talent currently, I don't have him 2 but I really do love Durant. Wade drops here because he plays SG, is closing in on 30, and his ass has taken quite a pounding over the years, and he will likely be injured again multiple times in the next 5 years.

    8-Tyreke Evans- Young & can do it all as a big PG. Will get better and accend to super star.

    9- John Wall- Hasn't played a game yet which is the only reason he isn't higher. But he looks to be the real deal.

    10-Carmelo Anthony- One of the top scorers in the game, in his prime

    11-Kobe- One of the top scorers in the game, & so much more, but getting close to the downside of his career. Am I even going to want him on my team in 5 years? I think that is a legitimate question. Also, very easy to dislike, especially for always trying to act like Jordan.

    12-Bosh- Duechebag list over 5 years? top 3. #12 here because no major concerns other than him not being a true alpha dog. He is somewhat of a stat guy in my book, not a truly great player, but he is obviously way ahead of everyone else, which is where I end because the rest of the guys have major flaws to be considered at the top. Huge drop off after here.

    I am not a fan of asthetically pleasing top 10's lists, I like to go deeper or shallower accordingly. So I go 12, the next teir probably is about 20-30 deep, guys who can be all star candidates and HELP you win a title if you got one of the top 12.

  • In reply to Dmband:

    Hey not saying he has earned a spot on this list one bit but Blake Griffin could be a wild card for this list i still believe the mans going to be a stud but i think if you asked this same question in a year or two he would have a better shot

  • Sorry Doug,
    I got Rose #4 here. I don't think there is a GM in the league who wouldn't trade the likes of a Kobe, Dwayne, Deron, or even Chris Paul of Derrick. Rose is 21, looking to make his 2nd all star team while making that superstar leap going into his 3rd season like guys like him do. He has all the traits you look for in a champion leader: Icey demeanor & will to win in great defining moments like the end of games & in the playoffs, simply one of the best work ethics of anyone in the league, unparalleled athleticism & strength for a PG, and great charcter.

  • I completely agree with you regarding the talent level in the top five, and I also don't think Rose is there yet. But, you have to be consistent in how you rank players and the extent to which you project their talent level over the next five seasons.

    If you can make the argument and project Wall's talent level in the top 11 players in the NBA over the next five seasons, I could make the case that Rose will easily become one of the best players in the league in five seasons or less.

  • He has to be a better at just about everything than Korver is, except for shooting.

    So if he is anywhere near Korver's league as a shooter(and since everyone thinks that we still need more 3 point shooting) Henry would seem like a great fit for the Bulls, short term as purely a 3 point shooter and long term to replace Korver when his contract expires in 3 years.

    Would you rather have Fernandez or Henry?

  • Didn't see a minute of it myself, but he did put up better stats than Rose toward the end of last season, especially assists, rebounds and 3 point shooting.

    Statistically, he was way better as a rookie than almost anyone expected.

  • He seems to be more of a leader than Joe Johnson.

    I don't know enough about the extent of his knee problems, I thought it was a meniscus problem, which is less serious than most knee injuries.

    Again, can't quible at the entireity of your list, but Bosh is more Gasol like for me, so a healthy Roy takes his spot for me. But you knock him out for health so maybe you are right, Bosh has been mostly healthy.

  • Just an FYI, but Denver could retain Anthony and still be in a position cap wise in 2 years to sign both Paul and Howard when they become free agents in the summer of 2012.

    So, it looks like the basic formula, is to have your own superstar, then target an offseason when 2 other superstars contracts expire, and strip your team of all other salaries.

    As long as the cap is greater than 3 times the max this situation will arise from time to time.

    It may not be executable every time, but with the success of this summers Miami splurge, it will always be a gleam in some teams eye.

  • I agree, Rose, probably because of his baby Lebron like athleticism has always been a bit overated, even it seems outside of Chicago.

    Hopefully, this is the year that reality catches up with hype/hope.

  • yea, something about him smacks more of workout warrior than basketball player.

  • LOL, not really. If I could have ended the clip early I would have.

    I was more thinking of the line "a sly declaration of new classic status slipped in to a list of old safe ones". Not that I'm criticizing, just that the John Wall pick made me think of it.

    But it's hard for me to hear a lot of discussion about "top X whatever" and not think about High Fidelity. :)

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