Time for Bulls to bury the hatchet with Krause?

Mike Ingrem thinks so:

Come on, guys, grow up. Enough is enough. At first the ridiculing of Krause was cute, perhaps even appropriate, but now it comes across as tall men behaving like spoiled, snotty, petty little children.

Why do Jordan and Pippen perpetuate this grudge? Apparently because they can. Krause is defenseless against athletes Chicago worships.

Jordan and Pippen are acting like bullies on the playground picking on a socially awkward kid in unfashionable, ill-fitting clothes.

Isn't it time to get over the animosity and recognize that Jerry Krause was one of the primary reasons the Bulls won six NBA titles in the 1990s?

All last week Pippen was called the perfect complement to Jordan. Well, who do they think was responsible for uniting them?

Krause gave Pippen to Jordan and Jordan to Pippen, and neither won any NBA titles without the other,

Without Krause surrounding them with pieces like Horace Grant, Dennis Rodman, Bill Cartwright, John Paxson, B.J. Armstrong, Ron Harper - well, they wouldn't have become what they became.

Sorry, I'm not buying it.

Jerry Krause told Phil Jackson in 1998 "I don't care if you go 82-0, you're not coming back next year". 

Why should Jordan and Pippen ever get over that?   Why should any Chicago fan ever get over the fact that Krause was more interested in breaking apart a dynasty than keeping it together?

Why should we get over the fact that Krause absolutely ran this franchise into the ground after the dynasty fell apart?

As a fan, it's hard to forgive Krause for those things, but if you're Pippen or Jordan?  Impossible.

If you were at the absolute peak of your profession, and had some cheeseball manager trying to end it, because he was jealous of your personal fame and wanted to prove he could do it without you, and then he booted you out the door, would you ever get over it?

(note, after said cheeseball was successful in kicking you out the door he was a complete unmitigated disaster in trying to recreate something great).

Why should you get over that ever?

Should fans appreciate Jerry Krause some?   Yeah, of course.

Did Krause contribute to the dynasty?   Absolutely.   Whatever you want to say about his hits and misses in terms of personnel, he did enough to win six titles.   He certainly didn't screw that part up.  He traded up to get Scottie Pippen, he plucked Phil Jackson out of no where.   He found Toni Kukoc in Europe.   He made some really all-time great moves as GM.

He was basically gifted multiple titles when he took over a team that starts with the greatest player in the history of basketball.   At the same time, he didn't leave much on the table in terms of titles achieved either.  However, when we had the best thing in the history of basketball going not only did Krause make sure to end it in 98, but he wanted to end it in 97.  

If you're married, your spouse probably did many things leading up to that marriage to make you fall in love.  Many wonderful, great things.   However, if 10 years later she's cheating on you with the mailman, your neighbor, and your best friend while dealing crack to the neighborhood kids and slashing your mom's tires then you're not likely to look back at the beginning of the relationship and tell your friends what a great person she is.

That's Jerry Krause.   Yeah, you did a lot of great things early on, but from 97 on his reign of terror was so bad, that it rivals Isiah Thomas as the worst job as general manager in the history of sports.   Let's not forget that you tried to trade Scottie Pippen twice, and Jordan had to get a promise from Reinsdorf that if he returned you wouldn't trade Pippen.

Now can we look back and acknowledge that Jerry Krause did a lot of great things over his time as GM.  Great things that helped craft our most fond memories?  Yes.   However, that doesn't tell the whole story, and if I were one of the people intimately involved in the Bulls (Jordan, Pippen, Jackson) than I wouldn't forgive him for the way it ended either.

Even as a fan, it's awfully hard.

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  • Agreed and agreed. The way the dynasty ended was such a spectacular and flaming disaster it was unbelievable. When you get a dynasty, you ride that b!tch til the wheels fall off! When is enough titles enough? The answer: NEVER!!!

  • I kind of disagree with you. Life is too short to carry on a fight. We can all say Jordan/Pippen/Jackson trio would have won titles anyhow. I think the best case if they had comeback was one/two max titles. Plus who knows how many they would have won without the "organization, trades, drafts" of Krause. Look at how Cleveland screwed up with LBJ. We can do the "What If" talk? But the fact is, there was a dynasty and he was a part of it. I am curious on the Jackson-Krause feud..Why do they/did they hate each other so much? Why didn't Reinsdorf step in and extend it? Is there something else to the story we are missing?

    About the after-Jordan era, he takes some blame. But unfortunately, almost like this year we struck out on McGrady, Hill and Duncan. He had some unfortunate incidents like Jay Williams and the talent pool was not the greatest in those drafts. I can't think of any franchise kind of players after Duncan's pick until LBJ's pick except for Gasol, Amare and Nowitzki(and they haven't won anything by themselves). The mistake he made was by stripping it bare and trying to build through FA. I don't blame him though. He wanted to rebuild a championship team rather than an average 45 win team. It was a smart business plan because he had the advantage of a recent champion and was milking it. In hindsight, we can say that unless you already have a great player in-house like Miami did with Wade, this stripping process doesn't seem to work(Chi in 2000, NY in 2010)

  • In reply to schaumburgfan:

    re: "He wanted to rebuild a championship team rather than an average 45 win team"

    Name another team in any sport that won multiple championships and the GM was eager to tear it down before they were beaten. It has never happened in basketball.

  • Journalists today always want to re-write history or re-explore some person of notoriety or infamy. Does this reevaluation stir up strong feelings and controversy? Yes. Does that make for ratings/higher viewership and commercial profits? Yes.

    How about this headline, "Come on, was Hitler really such a bad guy?" This is the type of revisionist b.s that you hear almost about anybody no matter how infamous albeit, "I knew Adol Hitler, I served with Adolf Hitler, and Jerry Krause, you're no Adolf Hitler." Hardy har. OK so Hitler is the anti-chirst/tacky comparison, but hopefully it makes the point.

    Again, today there are no heros. "Jordan was a prick. His teammates hated him. Scottie fathered more illegitimate kids then the state population of Montana. Phil dumped his wife for the Hollywodd/Lakers Boss' bimbo daughter." Etc. Etc.

    Well, here's one fan who does believe in heros. Scotttie was my hero. Michael was my hero. Phil was my hero. Especially in the first three champoionships. What did Phil say in his ultra brief snippet on Scottie at the HOF pre speech video? "Michael and Scottie were [the nicest to and liked each other more then any other great sports No.1 and 2].

    You don't win six championships without some good karma. Today Toni Kukoc(who Michael and Scottie did somewhat treat like poop - partly thanks to Jerry K.) plays "friendly wager" golf with Michael on Chicago area fairways. Kerr and Pax speak of him glowingly as does his partner Pip. Phil and Michael have drifted, but there was a kindness evident for those first two to three runs.

    None of my three heros who defeated the dirty deeds Pistons and loutish Knicks and gave me some of the best sports times of my life care for Jerry Krause. And neither do I. The guy is a prick. I do feel sorry for him personally because people like that probably don't even know better where as Scottie and Michael are aware of some of the terrible mistakes they made particularly in their post Bulls lives. And they have to live with the reprecussions of those mistakes. While a hard ass jag know it all ego who tells Phil winningest coach in history Jackson to "f-ck off, and don't think of coming to my daughter's wedding etc." will never get it. And by the way Phil's winning at any cost lifelong pilgrimage to me has turned him into somewhat of a joyless person as well so he's paid his price.

  • Yeah, I don't really hold a grudge against Krause. I mean, I don't know all the behind-the-scenes stuff, which sounds really bad. But from looking at 1998 as it was happening...how was that supposed to go? I thought the last championship showed that the team was slowing down (I thought the Pacers had their number that year), and I wasn't convinced that they would win a championship ever again with that core group. So what do you do? Push a bunch of old men to sacrifice their bodies for 3rd place finishes in their last years? Or make a bold move to break the team up and rise like a phoenix out of the ashes?

    We all saw that the plan didn't work out, but I was on board with trying. I have a hard time blaming Krause for something I agreed with at the time.

  • In reply to Duke:

    What was the bold move? Not willing to pay Scottie Pippen like Houston was? Pushing the GOAT of coaching out the door?

  • In reply to scottplummer:

    Well I'm no Krause apologist, but Chicago agreed to the sign and trade that allowed Pippen to get paid like he did. He would've gotten less money if management just let him walk. But that team had to be broken up. Jordan and Pippen weren't on good terms anymore (Jordan accusing Pippen of dogging an injury) and Dennis Rodman was all over the place being a fool. Then the Lockout occured and no one knew if there would be a season. So Jordan retired and PJ wanted a coaching break. So it wasn't just Krause who broke up the team. Now the Bulls could've rebuilt if it weren't for JK's bad attitude and former Bulls players telling future free agent players to stay away.

  • In reply to Duke:

    back in the day my friends and i got invited by steve kerr to hang by the court during pregame warmups before the fans got in. kerr couldn't have been cooler. krause saw us and had security rudely run us out while kerr could only shake his head and apologize for his a-hole gm. his stupid breakup of the bulls came as no surprise to me. one thing you can count on, dbags always do the dbag thing.

  • In reply to Duke:

    The breakup of 1998 was not about Jerry Krause. Don

  • In reply to Edward:

    Krause had been pushing Reinsdorf to rebuild for years. This is on him too.

  • In reply to Edward:

    I was an ignorant, albeit die hard, teenage Bulls fan when the dynasy came to a flaming crash of an ending in '98. I thought it was Jordan & Phil who no longer wanted it to go on. I believed managements propaganda. I'm finally opening my eyes to the facts now, and it truly is unforgivable. We could have had more. I can't believe Reinsdorf let Krause get away with it.

    What a shame, just like the '85 Bears (and maybe the 2010 Blackhawks?), we were truly made for a couple of more rings.

  • In reply to Edward:

    Krause was not a good person to deal with. However, the argument seems to be that he didn't kiss enough ass. I don't buy it. By the way, I have stated this many times on the forums: Krause didn't break up the dynasty...Jordan did. Krause's attempt to break the dynasty up was in 1997 when he wanted to trade Pippen for the rights to McGrady. Reinsdorf blocked that move at Jordan's behest. The next year, Jordan was the one who broke up the dynasty...as he did the first time. Krause lied, connived, and deceived. However, Phil was HATED by Bulls front office people who also hated Krause. Sam Smith wrote about this in detail years ago. Krause was not a great GM, not a great people person. But he did more to help create that dynasty than destroy it....there is really nothing there to be bitter about.

  • In reply to Houston:

    "...the argument seems to be that he didn't kiss enough ass. I don't buy it."

    I don't buy it either. Your premise, I mean. A good manager does not need to kiss the asses of his top performers. A successful manager makes his top performers feel respected and highly valued, and he does his best to compensate them at a level that is commensurate with their contributions to the bottom line of the business. Your admission that "Krause was not a good person to deal with" is evidence that it is generally perceived by most everyone with any knowledge of the NBA that Jerry was not an effective manager. The fact that Jordan was the one who wanted to "break up the dynasty" (if it is indeed fact) does nothing to disprove this perception. In fact it probably reinforces it, in the sense that Krause's top performer wanted out and as Jordan's manager he was powerless to stop him. Krause was unable to make Michael feel sufficiently valued for his contribution to the franchise.

    Also, Phil being "hated by Bulls front office people" is a red herring--it has nothing to do with whether or not Bulls fans should bury the hatchet with Krause. But, to go along with the diversion, do you have any corroboration of that assertion? Other than Sam Smith, I mean? Because Sam, while often insightful, is pretty well-known for tossing out disputed claims.

  • In reply to SloanVanLier:

    Steve Rosenbloom has been saying a lot of this stuff on the radio for years. As well as other guys in the know...it has been an ongoing critique from the beat writers and NBA writers who were around the Bulls that perception concerning Jordan and everybody else was not reality, yet fans persist in believing a lot of fairy tales, and these people disliked Krause too, and that went both ways.

    AS far as Jordan's treatment, he was treated like a superstar should be treated, he was well compensated, had his own personal baseball fantasy camp, and got no flak for his roles in breaking up the dynasties. Jordan was not wronged by the organization in any way.

    The Phil Jackson thing is NOT a red herring, its a sign that maybe things were bad on both sides? I know that people don't want to accept that, but that is the way it was. For example, Jordan already knows what Krause meant by "organizations win titles". It was later explained to him, yet, years later, he brought it up in his HOF speech. Why? Out of spite. Jordan did a lot of things that was inexcusable during his tenure with the Bulls also. People act as if he was perfect but that was not the case. Jackson was culpable to in the breakup.

    As far as resources used like Sam Smith, nobody...NOBODY has concrete evidence to argue against Smith's assertions. His statements concerning the drafting of Horace Grant were used by many as a way to down Krause, but the same person wrote about the breakup in 1998, vindicating Krause...and people don't want to believe it...

  • In reply to Houston:

    What are the names of people in the front office that hated Pjax?

    That's a new one.

    p.s. How is Krause vindicated? He never got another job in basketball. I'd say PJax is the one that was vindicated.

  • In reply to scottplummer:

    Given Phil left as Krause wanted and Krause got to rebuild like he wanted, Krause either helped cause the breakup or was JR's puppet and inconsequential.

    Take your pick.

  • In reply to scottplummer:

    What do you mean "take your pick"? In your world those might be the only options, but that may be far from reality.

    As far as Phil Jackson, Roland Lazenby wrote an article about some of Jackson's practices within an organization. I think people have to research what REALLY happened.

  • In reply to scottplummer:

    Sure I was upset when the dynasty broke up but I won't presume to know what went on behind the scenes. Everything we hear and read from someone else, even someone who saw things with their own eyes, is likely to be tainted with that person's bias. What I believe is that a bunch of rich guys with egos as big as their bank accounts didn't get along very well. That's a volatile mix with a limited shelf life no matter how much success it fosters.

    Maybe MJ and Pip will let go of their animosity when they're in their 70's. Maybe not. I don't care anymore. I'm just glad I got to witness the greatness. In a corny way the Bulls' dynasty holds extra significance to me. My neighborhood in Chicago got pretty bad so I went down south to start high school the year MJ was drafted. Thanks to WGN I got to watch MJ's growing pains as a pro while experiencing my own - as well as culture shock as a Chicago kid in Mississippi.

    Jordan and the Bulls provided a connection to home and a source of hometown pride while I was away at school. I turned 21 the same year the Bulls won their 1st title so it was like we grew up together. Like music and girls, Jordan and the Bulls were an important part of a significant period of my life. And just like with music and girls, as a Bulls fan there were good moments and bad. I choose not to dwell on the bad memories.

    I don't have any animosity towards the girls that broke my heart or the musical artists that sold out. When things went bad I simply had to let them go and move on. I feel the same way about the dynasty. It doesn't matter to me anymore who was at fault. I'm just thankful for the good times they provided.

  • In reply to Houston:

    Nobody has concrete evidence to argue for Smith's assertions either. That's the problem with using hearsay in a debate. The perception is that Krause isn't good with people. You admitted as much earlier. Krause never managed that part of his career well, i.e. convincing either the public or NBA players that he's not such a bad guy. This is a critical component of being a top-level manager in such a public position. It hurt him, clearly, in his efforts to rebuild the team after the championship run. He may not have been solely responsible for the public perception, but he did little to positively change it. That's a critical management failure on his part.

    What went on behind the scenes with Phil, Michael, Scottie, Horace, et al we'll never know. But what we do have is Jerry's record. And once he didn't have the greatest player and greatest coach of all time to work with, he failed miserably. Miserably. Worse than anyone could have expected. He drafted poorly, whiffed on free agents and coveted players who didn't belong in the NBA (Hello, Dali!). His public persona was grating and smug. He embarrassed himself and the team with his display at O'Hare in greeting McGrady. He set the franchise back for the next decade. This would lead one to believe that had he not taken over the franchise with the greatest player of all time already in place he might very well have driven it into the ground much sooner. No amount of historical revisionism (based on the controversial musings of Sam Smith, Steve Rosenbloom or whomever else) will easily convince most NBA observers to the contrary.

  • In reply to SloanVanLier:

    Incidentally, the one move for which Jerry Krause should be best remembered (but is often overlooked) is hiring Phil. For this I will give him massive credit. As I've said previously, Scottie and Horace were nearly no-brainers. Same with Perdue for Rodman. But firing Collins and hiring Phil was a masterstroke. It took guts and vision. It's too bad Jerry and Phil unable to maintain a better relationship. It's also too bad that Krause never again equaled this kind of brilliance.

  • In reply to SloanVanLier:

    I respect the way Krumbs Krause put the team together after Jordan was drafted and that I am Happy Krumbs wasn't there in 84 to draft some other player than Jordan cause he probably wouldn't have drafted him. Thank you Rod Thorn!!!! On the other hand Krumbs cannot be forgiven for braking up the Dynasty cause that team could have easily won 2 more championships especially in the shortened lock out season of 98-99. I mean you have the GOAT player in Jordan and a good cast of players that still had another run or two in them and the greatest coach of all time in Phil Jackson and you break the team up because of you the owner and GM feel that you have lost control of the team... WHAT KIND OF B.S. IS THAT??? Reinsdork and Krumbs should never be forgiven because they simply let their egos get in the way and even though their employees were winning them championships, those 2 dorks got tired of kissing their ass and tore the entire team down. I will never forget how they just completely dismantled that team just to rebuild. I tll you what... Karma is a big Bitch and Reinsdork and Krumbs are still paying for it today 12 years later. And now with the crap going on down in Miami, it will be a little bit harder to overcome their decision to dismantle a championship team instead of trying to ride it out as long as you can. This is why the Bulls management need to continue to make all of the right moves to correct what they did over a decade ago. That includes bringing in the right players and treating them the way they should be treated.

  • In reply to SloanVanLier:

    Krause was one of the most dislikable human beings ever, but Reinsdorf owns the team, and he could have intervened if he wanted to win one or maybe two more championships.

    I think that he simply made the calculation that with Jordan going on 36 it wasn't worth giving Pippen the contract that he was going to get on the open market(essentially overpaying him for the rest of his career to make up for being grossly underpayed for his prime).

    Reinsdorf could have gotten Phil, Michael and Scottie together in a room and found out what it would have taken to get them all back for another year, but he never seemed interested.

    Michael could have taken a pay cut and let Pippen make $30 million for one season, but his ego wasn't going to let that happen.

    Phil might have been the one that Krause really drove away, which made it the end for Michael and then Scottie. Hey Jerry Buss drove Jackson away to, before he came to his senses after losing for a couple of seasons and paid him twice his previous already record salary.

    Krause was just Reinsdorfs lackey, a world record jerk of a lackey, but a lackey non the less.

    On the night of the Rodman trade in the summer of 95, I called all my friends in Chicago(I was already living in San Diego)and predicted a 70 win season and a second 3 peat. I stopped at a 3 peat because even in the summer of 95 I knew that Reisndorf would never pay Pippen with Jordan on the wrong side of 35. In the end that is the essence of what happened, Krause just made it a far more miserable ride than it needed to be.

  • In reply to BigWay:

    Again, not true...he talked to Michael extensively about coming back for another run, offering him more money and more power...Jordan was just tired and didn't want to do it anymore.

    He said at his retirement press conference that it wasn't about Phil Jackson, he played without Phil before. He was mentally and physically fatigued...and didn't want to go through the grind at all.

  • In reply to Edward:

    The total opposite of what you stated is true. Reinsdorf was the one behind the scenes trying to keep the team together, going to extreme measures to do so. And Reinsdorf disagrees with his GMs often, the reason why he is beloved by his employees is because he trusts them and is loyal to them. He has blocked moves by GMs before in both organizations, but a vast majority of the time he just wants to be aware of what is happening and he of course gets the final call on big financial decisions. But he didn't plan to "take over" the team. Most people in the know will tell you, Jordan, Jackson and others knew who the boss was...and it wasn't Krause or Jordan.

  • In reply to Edward:

    I have to disagree with you. The rebuild was mainly JK's ego getting to big. He proved to JR that he could build a dynasty by putting the right guys around Jordan. He convinced JR he could do it again. He gutted the team for cap space and would have been successful if his plans would have followed through. He has Elton Brand and cap space for major free agents. Imagine what kind of team he could've put together with Brand, Hill/McGrady, and Duncan. He also thought he could pull a coach out of the blue again by hiring long time friend Tim Floyd. To bad the plan in his head didn't make it to the basketball floor.

  • In reply to Duke:

    I still like Krause. You have to respect hi scouting ability.

  • In reply to souleater7:

    Really? I mean, he hit the jackpot on Scottie, but Pip was pretty well-known by about half the league by the time the draft happened. Krause was just lucky Seattle hadn't gotten the word yet way up there in the Pacific NW (and needed a big man so badly they thought Polynice would be a legit answer). But what other great scouting did Krause do that leads you to believe he was even a decent scout? Some say he "found" Earl Monroe for Baltimore back in the day, but even that's disputed.

    Krause signed on with the Bulls in 1985 and promptly drafted Keith Lee. Ugh. Good thing he traded him for Charles Oakley. But in the process he left Karl Malone, Joe Dumars, A.C. Green and Terry Porter on the board. In the next draft, against Jordan's (and pretty much everyone's) better judgment he took Brad Sellers. Epic fail. There weren't many great choices after Sellers in that draft, but at least a handful of guys who far out-performed Brad over their careers.

    In '87 he plucked two of the best players from the draft in Pippen and Grant. They also happened to be players who filled needs for the Bulls, so it was kind of a no-brainer. After that Krause starts rolling downhill, draft-wise:

    Stacy King over Shawn Kemp, Nick Anderson or Tim Hardaway; Jeff Sanders over Vlade Divac or Cliff Robinson; Byron Houston over P.J. Brown; Corie Blount over Nick Van Exel (who, incidentally, were teammates, demonstrating that Krause couldn't even scout the most valuable player on a given TEAM, let alone in a whole draft); Dickey Simpkins ('nuff said); Jason Caffey over Michael Finley (when you have a low draft choice you can afford to take a risk on a star player with injury problems, especially a talented local player, unless you're Jerry Krause); Dragan Tarlac ('nuff said); Travis Knight over Othella Harrington or Shandon Anderson; Keith Booth over God Shammgod (just kidding, I had to throw that one out there); Corey Benjamin over Rashard Lewis; Marcus Fizer over Mike Miller; Dalibor Bagaric ('nuff said); A.J. Guyton, Jake Voskuhl AND Khalid El-Amin over Eddie House, Eduardo Najera or Michael Redd (!); Tyson Chandler over Pau Gasol; Eddy Curry ('nuff said, but anyway...) over Jason Richardson, Shane Battier, Joe Johnson, Richard Jefferson, Zach Randolph and Tony Parker; Trenton Hassell over Gilbert Arenas, Mehmet Okur and Bobby Simmons; Jay Williams over Amare Stoudemire; Roger Mason Jr. over Carlos Boozer (that one cost millions to correct, eh?); and in one last awful gasp, Lonny Baxter over Matt Barnes or Rasual Butler.

    Now I'll grant that lots of GMs erred in not taking many of these players. Any draft is a big unknown. I'll also grant that Krause got a few picks right over the years. But even some of them didn't perform to expectations (Crawford, Artest, even arguably B.J. Armstrong) for the team in the long run. And Krause's few successes, compared to his massive number of failures, could have been achieved by throwing darts at a draft board.

    Krause's over-valuing of European players such as Kukoc (you would have expected the second coming of MJ based on Jerry's giddy enthusiasm), Tarlac (an utter embarrassment of a player) Bagaric (a slightly larger, less muscular embarrassment), and even free agent Kornel David (Hungarian hoops "star" who had no business setting foot in an NBA arena without paying standard ticket price) was also a suspect element of his personality as a GM.

    Sorry, even before factoring in the contentious relationships he had with Michael, Scottie and especially Phil, there's just no good reason to respect Jerry Krause as a GM. A better GM would have played nice with his most valuable assets, and he wouldn't have left the team in a decade-long tailspin as a result of his poor drafting and lack of trading/free agent signing savvy (didn't even mention Benny the Bull greeting McGrady at O'Hare yet...yow!). His body of work exposes serious tactical weaknesses and a petty, vindictive personality. I do not share your respect for the man.

  • In reply to SloanVanLier:

    I agree he missed a lot on draft packs but I think with scouting everything is a crap shoot and you really never know how one player is going to produce in the league. Still you have to give him credit for Pippen and Grant. Dennis Rodman, Paxson, Kerr, Kukoc, Wennington and even Longley, Harper. He put a team around MJ that helped him win six titles. It is what it is.

    I thought he failed with Tim Floyd and the Fizer years.

    The Curry/Chandler idea at the time with the rise of high school players like Kobe and KG was a great idea. There where no big men in the east other than like Alonzo Mourning. Having two talented 7 footers who where projected by scouts to be the next Shaq and KG was a tempting and pretty brass move. Is it Krause's fault those guys didn't live up to the Hype? I'm not sure.

  • In reply to souleater7:

    I give him marginal credit for Scottie and Horace. Again, it didn't take much courage or wisdom to know that the best kind of players to put next to MJ were slashing open-court types who could bury jumpers (and in the case of Scottie, handle the ball so Michael didn't have to). Scottie was no longer a secret by the time that draft rolled around. Krause gets a bit more credit for Horace because he understood that a slow-footed, nailed-to-the-ground type of PF like Oakley (who couldn't hit jumpers with any consistency yet at that point in his career) wasn't going to operate alongside Jordan as effectively as a quicker guy with hops who could also bury 10-15 ft. jumpers all day like Horace. The rest of the guys you mention (other than Rodman, which was a total no-brainer for a marginal player like Perdue--only a risk because of Rodman's personality, but didn't take any "sleuth-like" knowledge to grasp) were all "nice" complimentary types, but don't really demonstrate any kind of special scouting talent on Krause's part.

    That he "failed with Tim Floyd and the Fizer years" is a vast understatement. I'll agree that the idea of taking a HS player after the successes of KG and Kobe might not have been too bad, but the idea of trading your young, #1 overall pick in order to take two of them at once definitely was bad. You ask, "is it Krause's fault those guys didn't live up to the hype?" To that I would answer, yes, absolutely. After drafting Elton Brand Krause made a big deal out of his hands--how incredibly large and strong they were. He made it seem as if this was a reason he had confidence in drafting him. Good move, decent scouting. Then he traded him to draft a kid who, to this day has not grown a pair (of hands, I mean). "Hands" used to be my nickname for Chandler, due to his deficiency in that area. Krause did a lousy job of scouting both Chandler and Curry. He should have known that the beanpole kid wasn't much of a leaper/shotblocker despite his stature (and would take a long time to be anything more than a beanpole) and also had no real offensive moves, while the tubby kid had skills but no NBA-caliber desire/heart. These issues were being questioned about both players at the time they were drafted. Krause chose to ignore them. So yeah, I blame him.

  • In reply to SloanVanLier:

    Again, it didn't take much courage or wisdom to know that the best kind of players to put next to MJ were slashing open-court types who could bury jumpers (and in the case of Scottie, handle the ball so Michael didn't have to).

    Really? Because most of what I've read of NBA history is that the conventional wisdom of the day was that you needed a good low-post player to have any chance to win a championship. It's the reason Portland drafted Sam Bowie, after all.

    I would have thought that the common wisdom at the time would have been that Scottie and Horace wouldn't have been important as chasing a center. In fact, most of what I've read--and remember being said--about the Bulls was that it was very remarkable how they won the championship--that no team with that kind of roster construction had ever won a championship.

    I admit I didn't follow the NBA around the time Scottie was drafted, but was it really that obvious that that was the kind of guy the Bulls should have gone after? It seems contrary to what I thought was the prevailing wisdom of the time.

  • In reply to Duke:

    The Bulls drafted Olden Polynice with their first pick (8th overall) in '87, who on paper was the best Center available at that slot. There were no other Centers to chase. Pippen had made serious waves in the pre-draft camps and was well-known to most GMs by draft day (even us regular fans had heard of him shortly prior to the draft, and that was long before the internet). The Bulls lacked a decent ballhandler at the time, as well as three-point shooting. Seven-footer Brad Sellers was an abject failure at Small Forward also. So the Bulls did need a big man, but what Pippen had to offer they needed more. Grant was the next best big (ish) man in the draft. Krause took the chance that Grant at #10 would ultimately prove to be more valuable than Polynice, and he made the trade with Seattle to get Scottie. I can't remember the exact sequence of events, but in any event this was a good move. They weren't going to be able to draft a "franchise Center" any time soon, so the next best move was to build with speed and skill. I remember being absolutely ecstatic after that draft, frankly even more than when they drafted Jordan himself (we all knew he'd be good at the time, we just didn't know HOW good!). But I don't believe what Krause did in selecting those two was extraordinary. The trade with Seattle was a clever move, but still not as special as, say, firing Doug Collins and promoting Phil Jackson. And that had nothing to do with his scouting ability.

  • In reply to Duke:

    *his

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