Tyrus rumors update [Timberwolves in, Bulls have solid offer]

Per Adrian Wojnarowski:

As the Chicago Bulls prepare to trade forward Tyrus Thomas before Thursday's deadline, the franchise's front office has suggested to prospective bidders that they have a solid offer of a middling first-round pick and expiring contracts, league sources told Yahoo! Sports.

The Denver Nuggets and Houston Rockets made bids for Thomas over the weekend, league sources said.

....

Nevertheless, here are two developments to watch with Thomas: Several league executives suggested the Minnesota Timberwolves could be a sleeper for him. Minnesota general manager David Kahn has been researching Thomas and has plenty of assets - three 2010 first-round picks, multiple second-rounders and a host of expiring contracts - to make it happen. Once the Timberwolves trade Al Jefferson this summer, they can re-sign Thomas and plug him into the frontline with Kevin Love. Jefferson is expected to be traded for a talented, young small forward.

....

Here's something else to watch: The Portland Trail Blazers were telling teams over the weekend they had a chance to acquire Los Angeles Lakers guard Sasha Vujacic and wondered whether teams might have an interest in obtaining him. This prompted several executives to suggest the Blazers were working on a three-team trade, including one Eastern Conference general manager who had been told the elements of the package included Thomas and Vujacic to Portland, the Bulls' Kirk Hinrich to Los Angeles and the Lakers' Adam Morrison, another expiring deal and a first-round pick to the Bulls.

So covering all these rumors:

The Bulls have an offer for a mid-1st rounder for Tyrus?   Sweet.   That's a great deal for the Bulls given Tyrus's status right now.   If that pans out to be true, then I'll be quite happy with the way things go in a Tyrus trade scenario.   Tyrus is gone.   A mid-1st isn't super valuable, but it's more than I thought we'd get for him.

The Wolves getting in the bidding is interesting.   They have their own pick [that's not being traded for sure], the Bobcats pick [but that has top 12 protection, the Bobcats are flirting right on the edge of whether the pick will be protected or not], and the Utah Jazz pick [low 20s].   They also have numerous second rounders.

The Rockets have a mid 1st round pick, so if the Bulls have a solid mid 1st rounder, then it could be from the Rockets.   Denver making a bid is interesting, because I can't think of anything remotely useful Denver could bid unless they're throwing out something like 2011 and 2013 unprotected picks, but they don't own their 1st this season, so unless the first part is wrong [Bulls have a solid mid 1st] than Denver's likely out of the running.

The final deal makes a world of sense for the Bulls based on everything we've heard them trying to do.   They unload Hinrich/Tyrus together, and they land expiring deals and a 1st rounder.   If the Blazers and Lakers are the teams involved, the 1st rounder would have to be the one from the Blazers which would be in the low 20s.  

The Bulls would get back Adam Morrison and another expiring deal.  Vujacic and Morrison match Hinrich, so the extra expiring deal would appear to come from the Blazers who need to match Tyrus and Vujacic.    The deal I can come up with that makes the most sense and generally fills this rumor [in fact the only deal that really makes any sense] is:

Lakers trade Morisson and Vujacic and receive Hinrich [they were rumored to want to do this while the Bulls were rumored to not want Vujacic in the past, so that makes some sense]

Blazers trade Blake, Outlaw, Howard, and 1st, and receive Vujacic and Tyrus [sure seems like they are getting absolutely raked over the coals here though, which doesn't match any of the Blazers past trades where they demand to kill every other team in trade value, granted Outlaw hasn't played basically all season, and Blake's not that valuable, so if they really like Tyrus maybe it works, but they get killed financially in this deal by taking Vujacic]

Bulls trade Tyrus / Hinrich and recieve 1st, Outlaw, Blake, and Morrison [masterful trade for them, given that they replace Hinrich/Tyrus with similar types of players, shed salary, and get a 1st rounder].   

If that final trade goes through then the Bulls will have impressed me again with another suave move at the deadline.   They haven't been able to land the superstar, but there are so many things that go into that which make it hard, but they seem to make smart trades every time they make one.

Comments

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  • Hypothetically speaking, let's say the Bulls did this trade.

    To Bulls: Brian Cardinal and a #1 Pick (Charlotte's or Utah's pick...both lottery protected)
    To T-Wolves: Tyrus Thomas and Jannero Pargo

    http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=ygv3pru

    That could workout for the Bulls. There looks to be some nice talent in the DRAFT.

  • Here's a thought though.

    I was reading the article about Ty Thomas to Minnesota and they brought up the possibly of Minnesota trading AL JEFFERSON for a Small Forward in the summer.

    Well, maybe the Bulls could work out a 3-team deal involving LUOL DENG.

    To Bulls: Chris Bosh
    To Raptors: Al Jefferson, Ryan Gomes and #1 Picks
    To T-Wolves: Luol Deng and Tyrus Thomas

    http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=yh4sgap

    Wouldn't that be nice, if Paxson could pull that off?

  • Here's another thought for you.

    That article also talks about the Clippers being willing to trade Marcus Camby and Al Thornton together. I think the Bulls should get in on that.

    To Bulls: Marcus Camby, Al Thornton and Mardy Collins
    To Clippers: Tyrus Thomas, John Salmons and James Johnson

    http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=yl9r3x8

    If the Bulls have to throw in a #1 Pick, so be it. It clears money for the summer and keeps them competitive for this year.

    How about it?

  • To Bulls: Brandon Bass, R. Foye, Mike Miller, Fabricio Oberto

    To Magic: Tyrus Thomas

    To Wizards: Kirk Hinrich, John Salmons

    PERFECT!!

  • In reply to joeacook3:

    I don't know if that's remotely realistic, but yeah, that works for the Bulls. I've long thought Miller would be a good return for Hinrich. He's close on overall talent but brings outside shooting and size at SG. His numbers haven't been bad in the wake of the Arenas incident.

  • In reply to joeacook3:

    Doug my question is. DO you think in any possible way we could get Al Jefferson from the T-Wolves?

  • In reply to joeacook3:

    I believe that it is "raked over the coals" Don't really see how the Blazers are getting hosed in any event, the Bulls are getting expiring replacements for Hinrich and Salomons, but not a replacement for Tyrus.

    Personally, I prefer the deal that nets the highest first round pick.

    My prediction for the trade deadline and beyond, Hinrich, Tyrus and Salmons gone, Deng is gone this summer in a sign and trade for a top free agent.

  • In reply to joeacook3:

    is it possible to get Rudi Fernandez in on all of this with Portland

    though not expiring he would look good next to Rose as a #2 then blake

    dont you think?

  • In reply to joeacook3:

    The Wizards are trying to get out from under contracts, not take them on.

    We lost our best Tyrus trade, when Haywood went to Dallas.

  • In reply to joeacook3:

    Definitely see L.A. wanting Kirk Hinrich for Morrison, Vujacic, and a late first rounder. I seriously doubt we're going to get a beneficial trade involving Portland. As Doug said, Pritchard always demands more trade value back then he's giving. Maybe it's Houston that wants Tyrus. I've read the Bulls are still in the running for McGrady/his expiring. I still think our only chance of attracting a big FA to Chicago is having room for two. Though I'd be happy just getting one.

    What about Hinrich for Harrington? Does that deal/story still have legs? I like the Houston deal either way if we get a mid first rounder. To me, if we clear out Hinrich etc. with major room for F.A.'s and still have room for one of two first round picks(one by trade) then I'd want the pick to be middle first and not anything after 20 or 21. You see good players in a decent depth drafts drop to 20-22, but after that in past drafts the odds of getting a good player decrease mightily. If we can get Elliot Williams or Dominique Jones as a backup combo guard that'd be very nice. Like Taj last year you've got two quality bench guys added to a potential F.A. attracting/constructed team.

  • In reply to joeacook3:

    Doug,

    Can you (or someone else) verify what actually needs to happen in order for the Bulls to even have enough cap space to sign 2 max guys?

    I'm assuming we have 5 guys that will be here next year for sure--Deng, Rose, Noah, Johnson, and Gibson. They combine for 22.8 mil in salary next season and 26.6 mil the following season (http://hoopshype.com/salaries/chicago.htm). Using the 22.8 mil number and assuming we add 5 guys making an average of 1.5 mil to fill out the roster, that takes us to about 30 mil total. I think the max deal is about 17/year, which means 2 puts us at 65 mil. I've read the luxury tax line will be 65 or less next season (http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=4312837), so it appears we would only be able to sign 2 max guys if the luxury tax line stays at 65 and we unload both Hinrich and Salmons. Is this right? Are there salary cap issues that limit us further?

  • In reply to rorypshea:

    Search the archives. About 2 weeks ago there was an article on salary cap space

  • In reply to rorypshea:

    Dont believe anything this garbage man Mr.Wojnarowski writes. He has become a joke of a writer in the past few weeks.

  • In reply to Newskoolbulls:

    What are you talking about? He's one of the most respected writers in the league. He's been all over the Amare to Cavs situation too

  • In reply to Dpauley23:

    O ya, the same guy who reported the bulls would get Charolette 1st round pick next year, which they don't have.

  • In reply to Dpauley23:

    NOW Wojnarowski is saying that the Blazers are offering steve blake, outlaw + cash for Marcus Camby....SOMEBODY IS MAKING SOME STUFF UP!!!! (i guess that's why they're called rumors but still...)

  • In reply to joeacook3:

    Woj is garbage, trust me. He may have some sources but he makes these up to get attention. Call me Dpauley when one of his rumors happens.

  • In reply to joeacook3:

    espn says that trade happened just a lil bit ago....

  • In reply to Dpauley23:

    If the Lakers want Hinrich and to be rid of Vujacic that's a remainder of his $5 Mil this year and $5M the next. Really, at 2.5 ppg and a career 39% shooter who is going to take this stiff? Unless it's possible for the Bulls to throw in cash(as someone else suggested) of at least $3 Mil to soften the blow of Vujacic's contract, I don't see anybody taking him. Which kills Hinrich's salary clear out to the Lakers for the F.A.'s we need(?)

  • In reply to Dpauley23:

    Hmmm...Roger Mason wants out of San Antonio...Mason-Salmons swap?

  • In reply to Dpauley23:

    Wait, Didn't Roger Mason get drafted by the Bulls?!?

  • In reply to joeacook3:

    Salmons got drafted by the spurs and dealt to Sixers. Yes Mason did get drafted by us in the 2nd round and played 3 years with us before being dealt to the Raptors for Rick Brunson.

  • In reply to Dpauley23:

    I'm sorry, but I'm convinced that Wade, Lebron, Bosh, etc. will skip the Bulls unless we have another star in place (and I don't mean Rose). I love DRose, but I don't think he, Noah, and Deng are quite enough to draw in a big name like Wade. SO, that leaves me to the theory that we need to trade Hinrich, Deng, and Salmons and get a Stoudemire type player in return. Hopefully then we'll have the space to still sign another top level FA.

    In my opinion, that's the only way we become contenders in the near future. As much as I LOVE Wade (he's my favorite non-Bull in the league), I honestly don't think even he can take us to the Championship with our current roster (minus Thomas, Miller, and other guys on the way out). As Doug said in his podcast, there aren't many top notch talents coming available in the next few years as there are this year, so it's time to go for it.

    Do the Boston: trade picks, players, everything but Rose/Noah, and get yourself another All-Star.. now. Just make sure there's enough cap space for one more.

  • In reply to jmwebb:

    Agreed that it will take one All-Star in to get another one. If they can bring in Amare now, I know people think he's overrated, but if the Bulls bring in the right coach he could get back to superstar status with D-Rose and a second All-Star FA. It would probably take trading Noah, Taj, and JJ or this year's first. Also it would have to be creatively packaged to give Phoenix some payroll relief. I know trading Noah(and Taj) would suck, but I seriously doubt we're getting Bosh this summer, and the only way Wade or Joe Johnson are going to want to come here and play with D-Rose is if there is a third pillar of talent, a second All-Star stud waiting for them.

    I know we will not get Amare because they will not trade Joakim especially for Amare's questioned attitude at times. So it's a moot point. But I would do it especially if I was planning on replacing Vinny with a name/experienced guy Byron Scott, Avery etc.

    It also may just be impossible to do all this, and have room to bring in a second F.A. And it may be too big a price for a lot of Bulls fans. But if I could get Amare since he's the stud/all-star forward available now I would do it. All-Stars this summer like Wade, Bosh, or LeBron are going to all want a Max deal anyway. It sucks that Cleveland or the fleecing, gets whatever he wants Riley in Miami are going to scarf up other then Bosh, Wade, and LeBron the stud FA of the crop. I wouldn't argue Joe Johnson's as big a stud, but they/the Bulls need a stud Big way worse then a second scoring guard. Gar/Pax(will not) shock the world.

  • In reply to SamS:

    I forgot to mention that the only way I give up those guys for Amare is through a sign and trade/or guaranteed contract extension. Again, maybe not possible, but if so then I definitely do it. No question.

  • fb_avatar
    In reply to Dpauley23:

    Did anybody else watching the allstar game get the sick feeling lebron's going to miami?

  • In reply to Redwhitenblack:

    as long as he doesnt come here to New York I am fine.

  • In reply to Redwhitenblack:

    Wade and LBJ are both ALPHA MALES, so that won't happen in Miami. Neither of those guys wants to play second fiddle to the other.

    Wade is coming to the Bulls!!!

    Here's why. For the Ring and Bling.

    The Bulls have a nice young core that with Wade and say David Lee or Chris Bosh, assuming the Bulls make room, (they will) can win championships (RINGS).

    Wade also know that if he comes to the Bulls he will make a TON of money off the court. He knows that playing in Chicago means TRIPLE the shoe sales, TRIPLE the jersey sales, and TRIPLE the endorsements.

    DWADE is not only a great basketball player, but a very smart business man.

    He'll be on the Bulls next year...you watch!!!

  • In reply to MrHappy:

    He will be in nice sunny Miami and I dont blame the guy. He won his title there and he is king. LBJ, Wade, and Bosh will all stay put.

  • In reply to Newskoolbulls:

    What's interesting too is the guy who floated the Haywood rumor last week is saying that there's three way going between Houston, Chicago, and 3rd mystery team. He couldn't tell us though as he to protect his source

  • In reply to Newskoolbulls:

    I am guessing this trade(Tyrus) will be to a West Coast Team and probably to 1. Utah 2. Clippers 3. Houston(if Bulls go for broke and go for McGrady) in that order.

  • In reply to Newskoolbulls:

    FYI:

    The Bulls signed Chris Richard to a second 10-day conract.

    http://realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/64720/20100215/bulls_sign_richard_to_second_10_day_deal/

    That's a good thing for him and the Bulls.

  • In reply to Newskoolbulls:

    According to Chad Ford this 3 way between LAL, POR, CHI is heating up and it's actually gonna go like this:

    Lakers: Kirk Hinrich

    Bulls: Steve Blake, Travis Outlaw, Adam Morrison, Juwan Howard

    T'Blazers: Tyrus Thomas, Sasha Vujacic

  • In reply to rorypshea:

    Blazers will not be dealing Rudy, they believe he will be an all-star in this league. The Blazers view their young guys very highly. I bet Batum and Bayless are not availble as well.

  • fb_avatar
    In reply to rorypshea:

    The Bull/Blazers/Lakers trade sounds good except morrison should go to the Blazers, not the Bulls. Otherwise, I think the Bulls need to throw in cash or something.

    I think the biggest risk bringing is the threat that Adam would have to end up crashing on joakims's couch at some point.

    Correct me if i'm wrong but it'd have to look like this which I'm all for -

    To Bulls: Outlaw, Blake, Portland 1st rnd pick
    To Lakers: Juawann Howard, Kirk Hinrich
    To Blazers: Vujacic, Morrison

    http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=yl8l6vd

  • In reply to rorypshea:

    Without moving Deng there is no shot at 2 max guys.

    Deng, Hinrich, Salmons and Tyrus all have to be gone to sign 2 max. With all those stiffs gone we only have Rose, Noah, Johnson and Taj under contract at something less than $12 million, add 8 or 9 cap holds at the NBA minumum and you add about $5 million more for a total of $17 million.

    Double max will be about $33 million, so any cap over $50million and the Bulls can sign 2 max guys.

    This is why we should try to get McGrady for Hinrich, Salmons and Tyrus, or Deng.

    However, we might get by keeping Deng for use in a "forced" sign and trade. All we have to do is get 2 guys to agree to join the Bulls together, sign one outright and use Deng as bait to sign and trade the other.

    Either way we need to blow this thing up completely, keeping only Rose and Noah. I think that the only way that we have a shot at the top 3-4 guys is if we find a way to get 2 of them together, if not I believe we get shut out from the top guys, and settle for leftovers, or save our cap space for 2011 and the year of Carmelo.

  • In reply to joeacook3:

    Let's make a deal!

    Kirk Hinrich, Tyrus Thomas, John Salmons for Javaris Crittenton, Antwan Jamison, & Mike Miller. Wizards get a legit PG & a young PF, & a shooting guard. Bulls get a 2 guard to stretch the floor & a PF who can play inside & out. Plus they will still have cap room for a max offer with Crittenton & Miller deals expiring.

  • In reply to joeacook3:

    I wouldn't be surprised if we just traded Tyrus straight up for Luis Scola or something....

  • Butler and Jamison to the Celts for garbage, yea he is amazing.

  • I was thinking about a sign-and-trade in the summer.

  • That's not God awful at all.

    Al Thornton is a way better player than your CRUSH, James Johnson. Marcus Camby is a great veteran big-man, who could help the Bulls make a playoff run this season. Mardy Collins is a strong defensive player, who can also knock down 3 point shots.

    Tyrus is leaving no matter what. Salmons needs to come off the books for a MAX free-agent possibility. James Johnson SUCKS and isn't playing.

    The #1 Pick doesn't have to happen.

    There is PLENTY OF VALUE in that trade. I'm sorry if you don't want your CRUSH to be traded, but he needs to be.

  • In reply to MrHappy:

    I agree that trade is god awful.... where does Camby fit into this team with Noah and Miller on the roster? Noah practiced today so Im assuming hes getting better. I still think its too early to quit entirely on Johnson if he could get into shape he could still be an NBA player.

  • I read on Hoopsworld that Nick Young is available now. I would trade James Johnson or Jannero Pargo straight up for that kid.

    He could help the Bulls long-term at SG and he is good friends with Taj Gibson.

    The money isn't too bad.

  • Hoopsworld seems to think that a Tyrus Thomas deal is already in place. With who? They didn't say.

    Also, Outlaw and Blake were supposedly offered up for Camby. The Bulls can put together a way better package than that and get a few of the Clippers expiring contracts.

    See my SMART trade above...it's at the very top.

  • In reply to MrHappy:

    poopsworld is BS.
    and that trade was terrible.

  • In reply to Fumbles:

    How BS is Hoopsworld? I hope the Camby deal doesn't go through.

  • the ever elusive "Upside Baby" of course

  • Why on earth would the the Rockets want to get rid of Scola(whom the Bulls could have drafted if they had a brain in the room)a hard working smart NBA power forward for a retard like Thomas.

    I would love Scola on the Bulls next to Noah this season(and Lebron and Joe Johnson next season).

    With Scola at power forward we could challenge for the 5-6 spots in the east this season.

  • Therein lies the rub,

    Here's one nobody thought of yet, Deng and Tyrus/or Salmons for Ray Allen.

    Celtics win the basketball deal, we get massive cap space.

  • Boy am I glad you guys are fans and not GMs! Panic at the first sight of smoke. Nothing, aside from the Mavs-Wiz deal, has gone down yet and with every rumor you guys are ready to sell the farm and settle for whatever you can get your hands on. Not that GarPaxdorf deserves too any kudos (yet), I do have a smigden of faith in them that we'll be in great position come summer 2010. It's on the Cavs, Heat and Raptors to keep their players at any costs. And if they can't, all the better for us.

    The Bulls put in a plan when they got Rose and it makes no sense to abandon it now when we're so close. We can still take advantage of opportunities, which the Bulls are doing (they've put in calls to Phoenix again to talk about Amar'e), but it's not time to panic. You guys underestimate the draw of Chicago and the draw of Rose. Chicago is the third largest market in the U.S. Salary is great, but marketing money is KING. There is NO cap. Even with a max deal these guys will make less money than what they are worth. The max salary has been estimated at between $15-17 mil next year. There are currently 10 players making $17+ mil THIS YEAR alone. Plus, with the new collective bargaining agreement, there is a greater threat to their earning potential on the court. Small markets like Cleveland, Miami and Toronto can't fuck with Chicago dollars. National money is still there, but only NYC and LA trump Chicago's local market which serves as a multiplier for the national and international market.

    And don't underestimate the potential of Derrick Rose. Like Kobe, LeBron and Wade before him this kid has played only a season and a half and is a certified All-Star. They went on to blossom into the Alpha males we respect today and covet for our team. Why don't you think we don't have that already in Rose? He's on that same path and playing the most difficult position of all. You think these other players don't recognize that and would want to play here? Players know! D-Rose is a lighter, quicker, smarter, hungrier and more unselfish Baron Davis with an actual work ethic. He's going to be an absolute BEAST in a year or two and make his teammates, whoever they are, look even better. That's what Kobe, LeBron and Wade do and they aren't even point guards. Imagine what Rose will be able to do for them. Look at what Chauncey does for Carmelo, Kidd does for Dirk and Nash does for Stoudemire. The combination of Rose's skills is better than all of them and he's still a pup learning and developing. He's not going to be a second banana or sidekick. He's going to be the big dog.

  • This is the DEADLINE BLOCKBUSTER to make, if John Paxson wants to win a title.

    To Bulls: David Lee and Darko Milicic
    To Knicks: Amar'e Stoudemire and Tyrus Thomas
    To Suns: Luol Deng, Jordan Hill, Chris Duhon and a draft pick

    http://www.realgm.com/src_checktrade.php?tradeid=5467523

    That sets the Bulls up for a trio consisting of DROSE, DLEE and DWADE.

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